An e-mail I received this morning

by borgfree 26 Replies latest jw friends

  • dedalus
    dedalus
    Jesus Christ said He was giving a new command "that we love each other" who can argue with that message?

    Sure,loving each other is good. "Christian" love seems to have a way of going sour, in my opinion. I won't pretend to know exactly why that it -- maybe because it's based on ransom sacrifices or something, who knows. There are very few people who can actually practice Christian love, involving, as it does, the very strict censuring of oneself (if your eye stumbles you, cut it out) and of others (don't associate with those not like you is a common Christian theme, though not universal). Anyway.

    The example Jesus set was always good.
    Well, maybe, maybe not. He did curse a tree that didn't bear fruit out of season, which was pretty dumb, in my opinion. He spoke in riddles that no one understood, was more confusing than a Greek oracle, which was pretty lame, in my opinion. He was rather rude and condescending to his parents and his disciples, but heck, maybe that was a matter of culture, right? Anyway.

    I don't think it is at all limited to Christians. Christians should take the lead in showing love and kindness to everyone, that is the New Testament message.
    See, I think it's condescending to say that "Christians should take the lead in showing love and kindness to everyone." It implies, whether you mean this or not, that other people aren't as good at being loving and kind because they're missing something that Christians have. When really, other people are just as good at being loving and kind as Christians.

    True Christianity would fit both of the men in this story.
    Probably if you got a room full of Christians together they couldn't decide what "true Christianity" meant"

    One chose to live a very simple life of working for food and necessities while distributing bibles because he was convinced that was the best way he could help people.
    Well, maybe there's something to that. Don Quixote was convinced that attacking windmills was the best way to help people. Didn't mean he was right -- in fact, he was a downright nut, but I suppose that doesn't make him a bad person.

    The other man was conscience stricken and chose to offer a little help to someone in need.
    Yeah, to another Christian. Wonder if he would've helped an atheist? Especially if the atheist never came around to accepting Christ or whatever. Think he would have looked back with such fondness at the meal the two shared?

    How can that be "us vs them"? I don't think any Christian would see this story as an "us vs them" story. If everyone in the world followed the example of these two men, would the world be better or worse? If that means following a Christian way of life, whats wrong with that?
    Well, maybe I'm out on a limb here, but I think that anytime you assert a creed or belief system you're pretty much setting up an "us versus them" situation, especially when that belief system is grounded in faith alone. In the story, there are Christians who feel deeply and ... well, no one else. Right? No other views are represented, no other faiths or thoughts about what makes a good spiritual life. And I suspect that, if they were represented, they're be shallow depictions of materialistic lost souls who didn't get the vague, "transcendent" message of this little anecdote.

    Anyway, I don't want to beat a dead horse, borgfree. Please understand that I'm not mocking your response to the story. My guess is that you personally are deeper than the story is and that your response is grounded in that, and not the actual text, which is pretty insipid and (I'll type it again, because I love this word) mawkish. Sorry we disagree. But I still think you're AOK.

    Dedalus

  • borgfree
    borgfree

    Dedalus,

    your comment:

    See, I think it's condescending to say that "Christians should take the lead in showing love and kindness to everyone." It implies, whether you mean this or not, that other people aren't as good at being loving and kind because they're missing something that Christians have. When really, other people are just as good at being loving and kind as Christians.
    I don't mean it that way at all. I just think that every Christian should know they are giving their lives to a way of life. They know they are to show love, kindness, etc. if they are to really be a Christian. People who do not take that kind of a stand do not have the spotlight on them. They may be just as loving, kind etc. or even more so, but people expect Christians to live up to the standards they preach, and they should.

    I only go to church occasionally so I may not see hypocrisy (if it is there) my experiences are mostly with ex-jw Christians. I have found them to be genuine and I believe I can count on them to be a true Christian. I haven't been disappointed (maybe once or twice) with any Christian. We are far from perfect, but all of them I know, are sincere and truely desire to do the right thing.

    I think your experiences may not be like mine, so you may view Christians in a different way, that is of course your right, and I understand that.

    Some of the things you mentioned about Jesus, I think can be explained, by very different customs, lifestyles, and probably translations.

    Borgfree

    "You can complain because roses have thorns, or you can rejoice because thorns have roses." -Ziggy
  • revdrjohnson
    revdrjohnson

    Hey, Zig . . .
    Long time!

    I'd call "Daniel" a RADICAL EVANGELIST!!!

    I've met a few like him, and they're always a joy.

    Met a brother two weeks ago who travels with a replica of the Ark of the Covenant in his van, and uses it as a Ministry tool. The encounter left me so BLESSED that I was on fire for an hour.

    I am in a series preparing three young ministers for ordination, in December. This is their second semester, and we are studying Evangelism. The class is tonight. I was just about to leave my office, and decided to stop by here for a couple of minutes. Your posting is RIGHT ON TIME -- it will be a good opener for this evening!!

    THANKS!!!

    By the way, wanna see some RADICAL tracts? Check out the "Store" at http://www.raycomfort.com

    P. S.
    SF . . .

    God has definitely NOT abandoned you! He's been DYING to talk to you, for a long time, but He needs you to be still so you can hear His voice.

    Keep the Faith
    RAY

    http://xjw-central.com/

  • bakedcanuck
    bakedcanuck

    has god been wanting to talk to me too? cause sometimes when i pee i feel like i'm on fire too.

  • Xander
    Xander

    We never know what kind of person is behind the image of a "bum" it could be a very interesting and unusual story.

    Yeah, but how many bums you know? The ones we get around here are...generally amicable...but crazy as a nuthouse.

    Most burned out on acid or something and are completely out of touch with reality.

    Not saying they are bad people - just that this story's message of 'don't judge based on first impression - why not give someone a chance' is fraught with danger.

    There is a reason why, when you look at someone, you immediately get a first impression. It is an evolutionary reaction every animal has. It's what let our species get as far as it has - by not trusting someone or something that doesn't LOOK trustworthy.

    If I was feeling particularly generous, I might direct him to the local homeless shelter. But, I wouldn't count on it.

    Xander F
    (Unseen Apostate Directorate of North America - Ohio order)

    A fanatic is one who, upon losing sight of his goals, redoubles his efforts.
    --George Santayana

  • Xander
    Xander

    And to the 'religion doesn't matter, it's the message' people...

    Read through the passage again. Replace every instance of 'bible' with, say, 'book of shadows'. And, every instance of 'christian' with 'pagan'. And every instance of 'Jesus' with, I dunno, 'Hecate' or something. Etc.

    Does the story still sound as nice and sweet to you? If it was about a crazy homeless pagan spreading his religion around?

    Or, what if he was distributing the Koran because Allah was giving him messages? And his shirt read 'Allah Akbar!' Still getting a warm fuzzy over it?

    Xander F
    (Unseen Apostate Directorate of North America - Ohio order)

    A fanatic is one who, upon losing sight of his goals, redoubles his efforts.
    --George Santayana

  • borgfree
    borgfree

    Xander,

    I would not recommend throwing caution to the wind. We should always be a little cautious.

    You asked:

    Or, what if he was distributing the Koran because Allah was giving him messages? And his shirt read 'Allah Akbar!' Still getting a warm fuzzy over it?
    I see your point, I would have to answer honestly, no.

    Borgfree

    "Creative minds have always been known to survive any kind of bad training." -Anna Freud

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