Gone Bad- So what do you have to say about Lutherans, Methodists, and Presbyterians....throw in a Baptist or two if you like :D
Did Jesus say his followers would be witnesses of Jehovah?
by blondie 53 Replies latest jw friends
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sd-7
John 8:14-18
New International Version (NIV)
14 Jesus answered, “Even if I testify on my own behalf, my testimony is valid, for I know where I came from and where I am going. But you have no idea where I come from or where I am going. 15 You judge by human standards; I pass judgment on no one. 16 But if I do judge, my decisions are true, because I am not alone. I stand with the Father, who sent me. 17 In your own Law it is written that the testimony of two witnesses is true. 18 I am one who testifies for myself; my other witness is the Father, who sent me.”
Huh. So maybe that answers the question. Jesus was bearing witness to himself, and his Father was bearing witness to him.
John 18:37
New International Version (NIV)
37 “You are a king, then!” said Pilate.
Jesus answered, “You say that I am a king. In fact, the reason I was born and came into the world is to testify to the truth. Everyone on the side of truth listens to me.”
John 14:6
New International Version (NIV)
6 Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.
If you put all that together, it kinda sounds like Jesus was bearing witness to himself, as the means of approaching the Father. Whereas JWs seem to focus on the Father's name/qualities as the means to understanding Jesus or some such thing, like you can only understand Jesus by knowing Jehovah (and "his organization", of course) first.
I may be wrong here.
--sd-7
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designs
sd-7 Maybe the problem goes back to the Filiogue.
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sd-7
Ah. I see I've entered a discussion that must be way out of my league. Filiogue?
--Edited--wait, I Googled it. Never mind. Gotcha.
--sd-7
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designs
sd-7 This particular subject comes up more often from Evangelical circles which sprung from the Revivalism Movement of the early 1800s. You don't hear the Pope shouting "can you saaay Geeezus, come on now give your life to Geeezus".
I mean seriously this is a very narrow religious sectarian thing.
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ABCXYZ
Good thread. Marked
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RottenRiley
FatFreak: Awesome points, they still will go over the heads of the Cult members, won't they? I never thought of it that way, thank you!
Why does the Watchtower hate Jesus Christ's name so much? When I started to use the name of our lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, the bells and sirens went off at the Kingdom Hall.
I had elders, family members and JWs ask me "Hey, what's up with using the name of Jesus so much?" It was not long before I was put under suspcious eyes of everyone. Why is that? I was not going around saying things like:
'IN THE NAME OF JESUS CHRIST, GET UP AND WALK!" to all the crippled Witnesses.
"I COMMAND YOU IN THE NAME OF JESUS CHRIST TO LEAVE THIS MENTALLY ILL WOMAN ALONE!" Never said that type of thing either.
"I WENT TO THE BEACH AND ASKED JESUS CHRIST TO CLEAR UP THE CLOUDS AND MAKE THE SURF EIGHT FEET HIGH WITH NO CLOSE-OUTS AND IT WORKED!" No, I did not make any type of loud noise, I used the name of Jesus the same frequency as we read in the Holy Scriptures, so why did all the family and friends get paranoid of using the name?
Also, I was not going all Trinity on everybody, I was using the name of Jesus Christ and this brought fear among my peers, why? Why are they so afraid of the name of Jesus Christ, it was like the demon possessed individuals who were brought before Jesus Christ and got really uncomfortable and began to scream at the top of their lungs, the fear the name of Jesus Christ brings to Witnesses is kinda creepy.
Do they think we are acting like Jesus Christ is YHWH, I never gave that type of impression and it still made everyone uncomfortable. They use the book "The Greatest Man Who Ever Lived" book to discount their avoidance of the name of Jesus Christ. Why do you think they avoid his name Blondie or anyone else? What is so fearful of the name of Jesus Christ that using it makes them squirm? Thanks!
Matthew 28:
16 Then the eleven disciples left for Galilee, going to the mountain where Jesus had told them to go. 17 When they saw him, they worshiped him—but some of them doubted!
18 Jesus came and told his disciples, “I have been given all authority in heaven and on earth. 19 Therefore, go and make disciples of all the nations, b baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit. 20 Teach these new disciples to obey all the commands I have given you. And be sure of this: I am with you always, even to the end of the age.”
Philippians 2:8-11
Amplified Bible (AMP)
8 And after He had appeared in human form, He abased and humbled Himself [still further] and carried His obedience to the extreme of death, even the death of the cross!
9 Therefore [because He stooped so low] God has highly exalted Him and has [a] freely bestowed on Him the name that is above every name,
10 That in (at) the name of Jesus every knee [b] should (must) bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth,
11 And every tongue [ [c] frankly and openly] confess and acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.
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Phizzy
Designs, do you mean the Filoque ?
from Wiki " Latin for "and (from) the Son", is a phrase included in some forms of the Nicene Creed but not others, and which has been the subject of great controversy between Eastern and Western churches." ???
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sarahsmile
=10 so that in the name of Jesus every knee should bend—of those in heaven and those on earth and those under the ground+— 11 and every tongue should openly acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord+ to the glory of God the Father.
Just one more thought on Jesus Phil 2:10 NWT has every knee bending!
Opps!
I thought JW were never to bow or worship a man or Jesus but only Jehovah God. Why have every knee bending to Jesus.
Who are the ones under ground.
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smiddy
After the scripture of Isa.43 :10 was made known to the Israelites , did they then identify themselves as jehovahs witnesses ? The historical record says no. No evidence whatsoever .Never mind that their was no J in hebrew .However they never identified themselves as Yahwehs witnesses either.
How long was it from the time of Isa.43:10 till Jesus ministry , decades ? centuries ? whatever they never identified themselves as jehovahs / yahwehs witnesses.
Was it because they were never intended to do so ?
The hebrew scriptures/ Old Testament contain the tetragrammatom yhwh throughout .
Nowhere in the christian greek scriptures does the tetragrammaton appear , if the almighty God was overseeing the integrity of the christian greek scriptures you think he would have preserved this.
Jehovahs witness apologists take a look at your Kingdom Interleniar of The Christian Greek Scriptures. Their is no tetragramatton , meanining the name jehovah or yahweh should not be their.
As blondie, Researcher, and others have pointed out the christian greek scriptures are all about christ and bearing witnessing to him , nowhere in the christian greek scriptures is their any indication that anybody else including jehovah or yahweh is to be given credence over Jesus Christ .
According to the christian Greek Scriptures .
smiddy