Critical Differences: JW's Today Vs The Past

by metatron 35 Replies latest jw friends

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  Vidiot

  metatron - "When Communism fell... It was the leadership that rebelled, believe it or not."

  Never gonna happen in Watchtowistan; by now, the structure of the heirarchy and ideology has become designed to completely prevent that sort of thing.

  Conversion to just another denomination isn't in the cards, either; that kind of action involves progressive reform, and at this point, any change in that direction and they'd arguably no longer be Jehovah's Witnesses.

  What's left besides stagnation and collapse?
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  metatron

  What's left besides stagnation or collapse? Simply put:

  Rot. Decay.... Spoilage.

  This organization may as well be a carton of milk that's way past its expiration date.

  It's too bad growth hasn't stopped completely, worldwide, because it would create a shock they can't explain away. ("why isn't Armageddon here?"). Failing that, we must await a less simple change that forces them to think and change: obvious decay.

  It's coming.

  metatron
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  TTATTelder

  I wonder which direction they will take when numbers begin to fall.

  They could say "we are being refined...you are the chosen few" (said with echoing God-like voice).

  Or they could just cook the books. I wonder how long they could cook the numbers and keep people thinking there is "growth".

  I would say for quite a few years.
• 

  DJS

  TTAT,

  It is almost a certainty they have been cooking the books for a long time. Lies, damn lies and statistics. They can change the definition of a publisher to someone who gives KH talks (I mean after all aren't there 'wordly' people or unbaptized people in the audience?) and never tell anyone if they wish. It is whatever they wish it to be. There reason for existence is the 'urgency' of the generation or overlapping generation or whatever, which drives reporting time, keeping the cong clean, marking others, judging others and generally creating a draconian loveless rules and task based borganization devoid of anyting remotely resembling true love or brotherhood.

  They will rot. Change is not within them.
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  metatron

  The Rot is here and has been growing for some time. It just isn't obvious to a deluded Witness ( yeah, redundant).

  I remember very clearly the beginning of the elder arrangement in the '70's and the air of enthusiasm amoung brothers. The Society suggested the idea that congregations could be filled with spiritually older men, not just a few.

  Contrast that with the situation today in which they try to hold on to whatever half-burned out men they have in these positions. And laying off the D.O.'s sends what message exactly? That the WTS imitates the world as a corporation and has a pathetic retirement plan for these suckers?

  Read any WT or Awake from decades ago and marvel at the reading comprehension level at present. Ask, 'why can't the Organization sustain itself on donations to the extent that it used to do?' Consider entire extended families that have left the 'truth' in your area.

  The decay is here. It just needs to stink a bit more.

  metatron
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  Old Goat

  I was baptized in the late 1940s. When I was a new Witness, average education level was high school or less depending on the region. I visited a congregation in the deep south in the early 1950s. They met in a shack. There was a largish knot hole that was the target for tobacco chew. (I’m not kidding.) On the west coast there were a number of well-educated Witnesses. The Watchtower was written using a vocabulary meant to challenge its readers. This was purposeful. Knorr wanted an educated (within a narrow limit) body of preachers.

  In the 1940s the Watchtower presented a number of studies in the book of Judges. These were prophetic expositions, presenting the Watchtower’s us against them prophetic vision. I liked the articles and believed them. I’ve read them several times since, and, while I no longer accept the Watchtower’s wild speculations, I’ve found them exceptional in other ways. The research into content is great. It’s far better than similarly presented material coming from other faiths. Someone, probably Franz, put some fruitful research hours into those articles. The prophetic scheme has no basis in Scripture. The back ground commentary is wonderful.

  By the 1970s many Watchtower articles were being written by someone who was culturally and functionally illiterate. Rather than underline answers, I spent my time editing the study articles so they made sense. In the later 1990s the articles were written for six year olds. That trend continues. Even when there is a good, scriptural point to the study articles, they irritate one’s literary senses. They’re written for the illiterate and under educated. This reflects the quality of current converts.

  In short, the Watchtower thinks you’re stupid. They no longer think you can be educated to any thing like a reasonable standard. They’re content to have believers be marginal. Some years ago at a KingdomMinistrySchool session the Watchtower claimed that “theocratic education” reached a college level. It doesn’t. No one who experienced both would claim that. It was a delusional claim.
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  Band on the Run

  You make a lot of assumptions that may not prove true. We lived in a notorious city. The nearest KH was in the ghetto. I feared for my life every meeting night. Most of the congregation seemed to be collecting disability payments. They were young - twenties. If you can walk up hills in all sorts of weather, you can work a job. A job would be easier to do. I don't recall Witnessses that knew doctrine or history. Successful people will not be drawn to the Witnesses.

  I did ask some Witnesses to come visit me about spousal abuse and the WT quoting a Nazi theologian when it did not have to do so. They had no idea what I was talking about. Further, they don't care about spousal abuse or Nazis. I think people love the belonging to a larger group. Everyone here seems to talk of the Witnesses dumbing down. From my perspective, they were always dumb.
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  gingerbread

  @ Old Goat "The Watchtower thinks you're stupid". Right you are sir!

  The WT organization has cultivated a population of obedient, mindless servants who look to them for understanding of all world events.

  The leadership crafts the blinders and puts it on the local elders (who humbly kneel to accept this resposiblity with honor). The elders in turn impose this on their own families and the members of the congregation. Parents imitate this 'correct' behavior modification method on their children.

  Worship the Governing Body. Worship the Mother Organization. Parents "give your children up to WT's Moloch".

  ginger
• 

  tim hooper

  The WT were always guaranteed the widow's mite.

  Now it seems that the widows might not.
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  Number 6

  I think Londo and Old Goat have it bang on.

  The Watchtower of today isn't a patch on its former self. I grew up in this organisation in the 70's and even back then there was a sense of urgency and anticipation. The brothers and sisters studied 'deep' articles and prided themselves on knowing the detail of prophecy, to the last detail. I can remember sitting in living rooms at group studies poring over books like 'Babylon the Great' and 'The Nations Shall Know..." etc. Its all crap of course but at the time we took it deadly seriously.

  It was considered a shameful thing if you didn't know the 'basics' such as how to explain how the 1914 date was arrived at. [pre 95].

  Nowadays the average publisher would struggle to explain anything other than 'do what the organisation says' and repeat verbatim whats in the latest dumbed down publication.

  I can remember being at doors with publishers who would engage in lengthy intellectual conversations with people and take the time to study and research what they believed in.

  OK now I know its all bullshit, but the point is that we believed in it and prided ourselves in using publications and the bible to KNOW, UNDERSTAND AND more importantly DEFEND what we believed in.

  Today coming home from work, I saw the new lite witnesses outside the railway station.... just standing a good 10 feet away from their cart with their literature on it... desperately hoping not to be engaged in conversation.

  If this had been my life as a JW I might not have had much to complain about!

  The JW organisation is a shadow of its former self.

  Maybe in 100 years they will be the answer to a Trivial Pursuit question "Name the american religious group who used to preach door to door but fizzled out in the early 21st century?"

  We can live in hope!

  Craig