by LostGeneration 46 Replies latest jw friends
I don't think we'll see the wbt$ suddenly fall like the Berlin wall.
They will continue to mutate but eventually like everything, entropy will ensure they go...I don't think it'll be in my lifetime though.
In any case there will always be some more nutters to take their place.....the world's full of them.
Another Ray Franz type defection and expose' may have a large scale impact. Elders seem not to be all on board with this new money scheme.
This is still a high turnover religion and will continue to struggle to stop the hemorrhage.
If 1914, 1925, 1975 and the "apostasy" of the early 80's did not do the WTS in, I doubt the donation change will. But did the WTS change, yes it did. Bit by bit letting the "faithful" adjust and the "doubters" pressured to go along or be labeled "apostate" if they do not "wait on Jehovah."
As to this quote, it was not Hitler but:
Joseph Goebbels:
“If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie. It thus becomes vitally important for the State to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for the truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth is the greatest enemy of the State.”
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As to people ponying up when a "deficit" was announced, my husband did that job for 10 years until he left. He was always robbing Peter to pay Paul and neither the jws with money and/or the elders were any more likely to donate more (and in several congregations). He said about 10 families donated anything on a monthly basis. That when a deficit was announced, in the next 2 meetings, no increase in donations. The saying that comes to my mind is:
You can't get something from a person, especailly money, that they don't have i.e. A turnip cannot be coaxed, squeezed, or cajoled into producing blood.
So if the ones who have it won't donate without strings and the ones who don't have it can't....
I do believe that many jws have been voting with their wallet/pocketbook, and I know some BOEs have refused to turn over extra money in savings to the WTS. What can the WTS do, remove the whole body? Actually this is a very inspired LEGAL maneuver making these BOEs put their reluctance on paper and vote on it. The WTS can hold the congregation as a whole liable for nonpayment. Perhaps threaten to dissolve the congregation, send them off to one or more congregations (separating families) and then sell the property.
Remember that starting in 1918, the best known legal mind in the WTS Rutherford, through a weasel campaign took over the reins of the WTS and proceeded to renovate it from top to bottom bit by bit culminating with the gutting of the elders in 1938.
LG,
Nice OP. Thanks. Excellent closing summary. As I've noted before and as many of you have also noticed, the OPs which typically get the highest number of 'Views" are those that deal very specifically with the 'latest' potential change/movement/information on all things Borgian.That suggests that there are a lot of lurkers keenly interested in anything having to do with the fate of the Borg. Human nature would suggest many of those are hoping for its demise and the sooner the better. But some are likely hoping for a kinder, gentler Borg where they can acclimate to it and keep their families intact.
Lurkers, read LG's closing guidance and follow it. If you wait on the Borg's implosion, erosion or transformation into something palatable, you will likely grow old and die before it occurs. We all would love to see its complete and quck demise, but that isn't likely to occur. Leave. ASAP with you and yours and live life to the full.
Never say never but I think the OP is pretty much spot on.
Even if only 25% donate $100 in a whole year thats $200,000,000 a year, now they are at 8,000,000 publishers.
Even if only 10% donate $100 then you have $80,000,000. Are you seriously telling me that the global revenues are less than $80m? The use of volunteers makes the money go further. The fact they own most of their properties outright gives them immense reserves in assets. Paying multiole times over for assembly facilities brings in even more money.
I wonder if this move is also going to protect against a possible move of DCs (sorry RCs) to JW owned venues on a smalller scale. The purpose of making 2 one day CA events has to be to enable greater capacity at assembly halls. Congregations are being encouraged to get teched up with projectors, broadband links and so on. I wonder if there will be so many RC events in large, rented stadiums in 5 years time. Get the R&F to an assembly hall on 3 occasions a year (4 if they do the AGM) and see the money come in on a building already paid for.
Interesting conversation, we really don't know and I don't expect a mass exodus either. However, it does seem from their latest new light on the donation arrangement that WTBTS is not receiving donantions as they used to and they are expecting some more difficult years financially. Why else would they make the change?
They may be preparing for a downward membership trend and thus will consolidate kingdom halls and sell numerous halls as the membership growth numbers are anemic and there is an increased apathy amoung the rank and file, and servant body. The internet is playing a strong role also with TTATT be readily acessable and the truth about Jehovah's Witnesses not hiding under a rock.
Consider how many times that you "Google" something that you want to buy, invest in, donate to, etc. to. This campaign to suddenly endorse the internet, thinking WTBTS is going to be popular with the JW.org site and that interested people won't investigate other writings about JW's and WTBTS is wishful thinking but in my humble opinion, it will backfire.
This new donation arrangement may serve as a wedge that divides the business savy elders from WTBTS. Don't think some elders are not confident to balk about WTBTS taking "their" money, that the local body with their congregation has control.
Traditionally, "spiritually" strong families, meaning families that especially enjoyed the coolaid have been the cornerstone of the congregations. Many of the parents of these family units pioneered before they married, and later have raised their children and offered them up to WTBTS as a sacrifice.
The low birthrate of JW's that used to provide new publishers and the high publisher turnover rate are not mathematically good news for WTBTS. It is admitted that they do not have the talent pool to draw from as they have in years past. The next ten years will be interesting because many in the congregations are beginning to get advanced in years and will die.
its far from an "act of genius" cult leaders abuse, do what they like and the sheep let them, but as Kneehigh says apathy is their biggest danger, they still hemorrhage members and when we start fading the "contributions" are the first thing that get booted, the world is still recovering from the GFC of 2008, some of the figures I see mentioned on here of the amount congregations contirbute is very surprising in regards to the low level they donate many from the USA and Europe.
Funny how I've watched these quasi-apologists expound on the Watchtower's future and finances for many years. While the WTS isn't the Berlin Wall, the rot and layoffs and cutbacks never stop. They never really stop the decay.
It's a fair point: don't wait for a Watchtower collapse or reform to ever occur. Life is not a dress rehearsal, get on with it!
As for their current changes, it looks like some sick, twisted experiment in cult sociology. A sterile "ministry", boring, pointless meetings, youth treated like so much wasted spawn, a corrupt leadership, and what does the future hold?
Elders assigned to beg for contributions. Elders who must bend lower to kiss the CO's a$$. Dying irrelevant magazines. Assemblies/Conventions that are a joke. Building projects pushed into an indefinite future.
Yup, it's all comin' up roses.
metatron
Punkofnice, I agree with that comment about the nutters. I usually sit next to one on the bus.
I did accounts for several years before switching congregations. All the big donations came from checks. It was the same people each month Donating. 10% provided 80% of funds. And since donations are private unlike field service time, you can stop donating and nobody will even know. Also despit watchtower claims we have not hit 8 million officially.
People genre are forgetting the most important factor. Time. As time passes the zealots die off. There are no young ones waiting in the wings to replace them. the older one donate the most. I know this for a fact from my time as accounts servant. The watchtower has access to demographics. They know theie time is limited by their inability to recruit new ones and retain young ones. Who knows how long it will take for the Borg to fade into obscurity, but it will happen and they know it. if the internet was around in 1975 there would be no JWS today. Think of all the people who denu we predicted the end I. That year. Any talks by crazy circuit overseers would be all over YouTube. the fail would have been epic.
