Matthew Powner- Advanced research on the Origin of life. How credible is he?

by KateWild 113 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • KateWild
    KateWild

    I have come to the conclusion that science cannot prove or disprove the existence of God. However the scientific evidence available is compelling enough for me to believe that a Creator is responsible for life on earth.

    I have read much about Powner and understand the work he is doing. I am interested in your views as to his credibility. I think he is honest and not trying to get results where there are none, but he seems to think he is going to be able to create life, with his research in his life time. What do I think? I don't know but I am keen to follow his progress.

    What I am convinced of though, is that anything he discovers or creates will not prove God does not exist.

    This youtube was made in 2010, the picture quality is poor and Powner as a speaker could sound more confident and resolute, because what he is saying is chemically accurate. Let me know what you think.

    Is Matthew Powner Credible?

    Kate xx

    http://vimeo.com/58303367

  • OneEyedJoe
    OneEyedJoe

    It's obviously impossible to prove that god doesn't exist. In my opinion, though, the idea of god doesn't actually explain anything, it just moves the problem further away at best, and realistically it makes the problem more complex: How did the incredibly simple, uninteligent microscopic first life form come to be? Of course an all-knowing, all-powerful being must've created it! You've just taken the question of how something relativly simple came to be and answered by supposing the existance of something incredibly complex. Science explains this by progressively stepping backwards to simpler and simpler things, whereas creationists explain it with one big leap to something that would have to be more complex than the observable universe. That's not satisfying to me, so in the lack of any evidence I see no use in entertaining the idea further.

    Sorry, kinda side-tracked your origonal question. I'm not sure how credible he is, but it wouldn't shock me if life could be synthesized in our lifetime. They've already been able to create an entire custom genome from scratch and insert it into an existing bacterial cell (and observe the results of some of the tweaked genes) so it's not a tremendous leap to get to building life from scratch.

  • KateWild
    KateWild

    That's not satisfying to me, so in the lack of any evidence I see no use in entertaining the idea further. Sorry, kinda side-tracked your origonal question- OneEyedJoe

    I intended the whole OP to be a mixture of evidence or not of God, and credibility of Matthew Powner. You did not get side tracked at all, thank you for your perspective. I have pondered on the question......................

    If god Created everything then who created God?

    The only answer I can come up with is that he has always existed and he is infinate. That doesn't really satisfy me to be honest. But the chemistry Powner was talking about satisfies me that there is a Creator.

    Thanks for your input.

    Kate xx

  • Giordano
    Giordano

    I expect, based on his work and peers, Matthew Power is credible.

    On a more humanistic approach Alan Lightmansays:

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/book-review-why-science-does-not-disprove-god-by-amir-d-aczel/2014/04/10/4ee476ec-a49e-11e3-a5fa-55f0c77bf39c_story.html

    "Several Years ago, I thought that the writings and arguments............attempting to disprove or prove the existence of God were a terrible waste of calories. I have changed my mind. I now believe that the discussions of science and religion, even attempts of one side to disprove the other, are part of a continuing and restorative conversation of humanity with itself. In the end, all of our art, our science and our theological beliefs are an attempt to make sense of this fabulous and fleeting existence we find ourselves in"

  • KateWild
    KateWild

    Giordano,

    Wow that quote is a great find!!!!!!!! I am so glad a credible physicist concludes the same as me. What a sensible conclusion Kate xx

  • OneEyedJoe
    OneEyedJoe

    The only answer I can come up with is that he has always existed and he is infinate. That doesn't really satisfy me to be honest. But the chemistry Powner was talking about satisfies me that there is a Creator.

    Yep, that's the answer you always get to when thinking about the beginning of god, and I agree that's not especially satisfying. I'd be just as satisfied to assume that some basic form of life has always existed and has been spreading through panspermia.

    I'll agree that it seems that the chemistry is incredibly complex, and maybe even extremely unlikely to happen by chance. However, every few years there's some discovery that seems to point to it being slightly easier and more likely to happen than previously believed. Just the other day there was a thread on here about the discovery of metabolism without cell walls. At this point, I'd say we're just a few missing steps from linking properly non-living matter to life, and there doesn't seem to be any reason to believe that the trend won't continue.

    However, even if it does turn out that life is so incredibly unlikely to happen by chance, I still don't see an absolute need for a creator. Current cosmology suggests that it's possible, even likely that there are an infinite number of other universes out there. So, no matter how unlikely, it stands to reason that anything that is possible to happen, would have happened in one of those universes. It's only in the universe where life somehow formed by chance and evolved into intelligent, sentient beings that we can wonder about how this incredibly unlikely event ever happened.

    This was one of the very first thoughts that I found I couldn't fully rationalize away as a JW. I was always something of a lover of math/science, and whenever the talks about the origin of life were given I could never understand why the apparent perfection of the earth and the laws of physics to support life was evidence of a creator. I always saw it as neutral evidence at best and at worst as somewhat discounting the idea of a creator. Sort of the same argument as above - if life is so unlikely to happen as is suggested, then wouldn't it make sense that it would only happen by chance in a place that is perfectly suitable for it to happen? It would be greater evidence of a creator if we lived somewhere that was extremly inhospitible to life, as such an environment would be more likely to require intervention in order to create and maintain living matter.

    I don't know if you can tell, but you've hit on a topic that I love discussing, and since I have no outlet for that it comes out whenever there's an oppurtunity.

  • KateWild
    KateWild

    I'll agree that it seems that the chemistry is incredibly complex, and maybe even extremely unlikely to happen by chance.-OneEyedJoe

    What Powner is talking about is the formation of nucleotides in the lab, using phosphorous molecules as catalysts.

    This process would involve the separation of d-enatiomers and l-enatiomers resulting in a homochiral solution that contains mainly l-enantiomers. The position of the different elements is important in the formation of RNA and DNA and then in living things. Homochiral solutions require an autocatalyst (Soai Reaction) to form, otherwise a racemic mixture is produced. (equal L and D isomers)

    A catalyst that is automated like this is evidence for me that probably a Creator is involved, that's why I draw a different conclusion to you, but I still cannot prove fully that there is a God.

    Kate xx

  • OneEyedJoe
    OneEyedJoe

    If you have any links that go further into detail, I'd love to read it. I'm familiar with the case made for a creator based on the so-called left-handed amino acids being the only ones used, but I don't see it as particularly strong evidence of god, but I haven't seen much of these latest developments.

  • KateWild
    KateWild

    http://www.chemistry.illinois.edu/research/organic/seminar_extracts/2003_2004/Todd.pdf

    http://www.f.u-tokyo.ac.jp/~kanai/seminar/pdf/Lit_K_Sato_B4.pdf

    I don't see it as particularly strong evidence of god-OneEyedJoe

    This is the point I think of this thread, that some will view it as strong evidence and others will not. Personally I think we either born religiously inclined or not, but many are reliogious and then become non-believers, and some that were not brought up religious developed a religious inclination.

    I hope you like the links

    Kate xx

  • KateWild
    KateWild

    I can't find any of Powner's work. That's why I am a little doubting of his credibility. If anyone can produce a link it would be great. Kate xx

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