by KateWild 113 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
It's quite possible, but you are publicly making the claim. Hence, it is entirely reasonable to question and comment upon it.-Viv
Sorry you've lost me, what claim? What reasonable question?
Apologies Viv you'll have to be a little more specific. Kate xx
Hi kate ;... Phizzy touched on the emotional need for belief in god.
I have sympathy for that viewpoint.
You have said in a few of your posts that you don't believe god punishes or rewards us, and that god is not concerned(is indifferent)to our suffering.
How do you reconcile the claims of believers who would argue(without proof) that god has indeed demonstated to them the actions you deny?
Would you say they were wrong in their judgement?
Could you be persuaded to believe in their take of gods interventions by their testimony?
My point being these are emotive reasons although conflicting for belief in god,
Which is correct ? Is it not therefore possible both are wrong as there is no proof to substantiate either.
Best wishes
Which is correct ? Is it not therefore possible both are wrong as there is no proof to substantiate either.- galaxie
Hey galaxie,
Good point, I was actually with my friend today who is an evangellical, she had a vision of God. I believe she did and it was a psychotic episode. The proof was her doctor diagnosed her with schizophrenia. She has had no more visions since then, a number of years ago.
We were also talking about the bible being from God. I showed her my evidence for what I believed and she showed me hers. Good for another thread. But she is right in her eyes and I am right in mine, we had a lovely time too. No harm done.
I suppose it's not about proving things to others it's about getting satisfying proof for ourselves. So I am satisfied I have enough proof there is a creator, and I am satisfied that science does not prove that no creator exists, when it can I will change my belief.
If you want to tell me how the Soai reaction proves God does not exist, fire away I am listening.
Kate xx
But the question is what is superior intelligence? In chemistry I see it in electrons, enantiomers and in the formation of RNA.
This sorta says it all. You see intelligence/design in nature. You have an entirely different way of thinking (not necessarily better or worse, I'll add) than an athiest. You see a universe that's perfectly suitable for life, and take it to mean that the universe was made for life. I see a universe that's so perfectly suitble for life and i draw the conclusion that either life only forms in a universe if it turns out to be perfectly suitable, or the type of life that forms in a particular universe must always be well suited to that universe or it will not survive long enough to reproduce.
In short, you see the universe as a pragmatic solution to the problem of a lack of life. (i.e. the creator wanted life to exist, and therefore had to create the universe the way he did) wheras I see life as the result of the particular properties that the universe took on.
I think this is a pretty fundamental difference in viewpoint that may not be a gap that can be bridged. I suspect, had it not been for your experience with the JWs, your desire for purpose-based explanations of events would have led you to live with a belief in a god that has an active role in human affairs.
Thanks kate, I wonder how many other god ' experiences are down to psychotic experience, anyway as you say another thread.
Best wishes
I see life as the result of the particular properties that the universe took on.- OneEyedJoe
This is a wonderful perspective and many evolutionary biologists have the same perspective, and then there are scientists who have the same perspective as me. I think we need to live together learning to accept one anther's perspectives. But I am still fuelled to make enquiries and find satisfying proof I am wrong about the existence of a Creator.
Kate xx
We know for a certainty that evolution since LUCA has progressed by natural unguided processes, resulting in huge diversity and often in less-than-optimum design.
Why do you feel the need to insert a creator pre-LUCA but not post-LUCA?
Surely this is just god-of-the-gaps.
"However the scientific evidence available is compelling enough for me to believe that a Creator is responsible for life on earth." - Kate
Wait, what!!!???
Or what I called it earlier Cofty "the retreat of the believer", they gradually reverse, even until before the universe existed if we bother to push them that far back.
Then, if you give them a pre-universe inch, watch 'em fastforward to tell you all about this "god".
Pathetic.
Yep , what "evidence"?
