Question:What do JWs hide from new converts?

by jerome 18 Replies latest watchtower scandals

• 

  Pathofthorns

  Could someone expand upon the statement that there is lack of love generally among the JWs?

  lol.. Obviously you were never a JW

  Basically you throw a bunch of people in a self-righteous and competive environment governed by endless amounts of rules and politics and you are bound to have problems. Personalities conflicts are common and the local authority (elders) in the congregations are often uneducated and incompetent men who seem to make endless blunders. Since JW life is all most people know, they tend to gossip about each other's affairs and this adds to the tension. An environment where people tend to be critical and suspicious of each other exists.

  It seems the closer you are to the "inner circle" in a congregation, the more you are affected by these things. I think these things are just an unfortunate by product of this confined and isolated and controlling organization.

  Path
• 

  Xena

  I personally wouldn't call it a lack of love myself. I have found a lot of loving people within the org. but then I have found a lot of loving people out of it too...I think where the concept of "lack of love" comes into play is where they over emphasise the love that they have, and their "worldwide brotherhood". They would have people believe that they have MORE love among themselves than normal. The people I met who showed me kindness probably would have acted that way even if they hadn't been JW's...they are typically kind people to begin with.

  The JW's take an act of kindness, any act of kindness among themselves, and atribute it to the org. instead of giving the credit to the actual person who performed the act.

  For example when Tim was in the hospital the "brothers" were very kind and helpful to us. When we quit going to meetings we were reminded of this "brotherly love" that we had received, and told that we would not have gotten this kind of help from anyone else. The only problem with that is that we DID get help from "worldly" people also during that time...indicating to us of course that you can find this same love outside the org.

  Someone make a good point in another post (don't remember what thread) that anytime you belong to a group you tend to treat each other well. Bikers stick together and help each other out, a "brotherhood", most Church members stick together and help each other out, again they form a type of "brotherhood". The JW's just try and say they are the only ones with this type of bond. And because they aren't it might be conceived that they have a "lack of love" when it is just normal people functioning within an abnormal setting (one with very high expectations of kindness and love).

  I don't think many JWs would admit there is an organized effort to deceive but they have been influenced to make themselves look more problem free than they actually are and things are certainly hidden from new ones for them to experience the hard way after much time has been invested in this religion.

  Excellent point! lol actually I believe most JW's deceive THEMSELVES in this way as well! I know I did for quite awhile!
• 

  detective

  I can say that my JW friend certainly gave a bang up version of "theocratic warfare" without using the term itself. When I was questioning him about the United nations ordeal, he described the act of not telling information to people who they deem are unworthy to receive it. At no point in our conversation did he say "theocratic warfare strategy" but without a doubt he knew exactly what it was and was more than happy to refer to it in a positive way. My friend is a "lifer" raised in it and he mostly spends his time trying to fly below the radar. He's completely "in" mentally, but I wouldn't say that he's invested much time in really pursuing the arguments or reasoning outside of accepting the most superficial version of Watchtowerese. I think this is important to mention because I would not consider him a savvy apologist along the lines of a YouKnow. In other words, joe Schmo witness may not know the terminology but they sure can throw out this defense at the drop of a hat.

  So, while the term might not be common among the witnesses, I believe the concept is very, very familiar to them.
• 

  jerome

  The problem that I have with theocratic warfare is who decides exactly is deserving of the truth?

  In my experience so far as soon as you rais their defenses they lock up and dont tell you a thing.

  jerome
• 

  ItsJustlittleoldme

  "The problem that I have with theocratic warfare is who decides exactly is deserving of the truth?"

  If you are not a baptized witness, you don't deserve the truth.. After all, you are still attached to Satan, and haven't given yourself to Jehovah (or more accuratly 'his' organization) yet...

  It also depends on the individual witness, and where the witness thinks how far along you are in the indoctrination process.. (Are you ready for 'solid' food yet or are you still at the 'milk' phase)?

  The more 'solid' food you can digest the more likely you are to be told the real truth...
• 

  In_between_days

  Jerome,

  Check out this site

  www.bible.ca/Jw-Wont-Tell.htm
• 

  larc

  Jerome,

  Do you remember when you posted your account of two JW women talking to you? You said that they lied to you on several occasions. They didn't think they told lies. They thought they were using "tact", or "over coming objections", or they were being evasive so they could get to a point they wanted to prove. This is an automatic process that is learned over years of field service. It is not a conscious, overt attempt to lie. As JanH pointed out, this is a complex, long term process of enculturation.
• 

  outnfree

  Jerome,

  I agree with the others that JWs don't mention the term "theocratic warfare" from the platform, but I disagree that they don't actively teach it. Almost every week there are field service demonstrations at the Service Meeting that teach this concept of deceit -- without it being said to be deceit. As larc opines they feel they are using "tact" or "overcoming objections" -- terms that ARE used from
  the platform. (Also, "graciously seasoning with salt" lol)

  Nonetheless, usually the witnesses are not being taught to truthfully overcome objections, because they are not supposed to actually ANSWER the objector's questions. They are supposed to carry on with their preprogrammed "sermon" and get THEIR message across no matter what the householder's objection. It's sort of like an actress promoting her new movie... when asked an uncomfortable question by her interviewer, she just blithely goes on promoting the movie by ignoring the question and getting her point across.

  It was the custom to have suggestions for field service on Page 8 of the Kingdom Ministry. There were set introductions, scriptures, viewpoint questions (allow for reply) and then, no matter what the response, a further set reference and explanation to make before pitching for a return visit.

  As others have said, too, Jehovah's Witnesses have it inculcated into them to never embarrass the organization. This means that even when it is the Witnesses' own doctrines that are the embarrassment, most JWs will avoid answering householders' questions directly and clearly. Better to rope the potential convert in with the nice things about the cult, and let them discover the incongruities on their own.

  outnfree
• 

  Sunchild

  They definitely do lie by omission, and one big lie that I was given comes to mind. They told me that I could leave the religion any time I wanted, of my own free will. What they DIDN'T tell me was that if I did, I'd be labeled as an apostate, shunned, and basically regarded as the spawn of Satan. I didn't find that out until after I was baptized.

  *Rochelle.

  ---------
  "I can teach you how to bottle fame, brew glory, even stopper death -- if you aren't as big a bunch of dunderheads as I usually have to teach."
  -- Professor Severus Snape, Harry Potter and the Sorceror's Stone.