Whatever happened has a lesson for us!

by Kalos 28 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  Kalos

  done4good

  What a nice summery! You really stole my heart. It’s amassing to see how you could capture my motive so well, and expressed it better than I could have ever done! I believe God acted through you—because in utter helpless situation I used to send good-wishes routed through God!

  Interestingly, I shared the view expressed in the post with some of the ex-JWs, and they liked it. Even yesterday I shared with another the same points—he too liked it! Then I thought I must post this. That is the history behind this posting.

  Thank you--done4good--for that!

  Sorry for the late reply—I had to work overtime in the press.
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  Kalos

  Syme

  Good advice! I take it in its spirit.

  In what I wrote, details are not important, but direction is (like what Shakespeare meant: ‘look at the forest, not the trees.’

  I chose that name—Kalos—because that is what my religion is: SPIRITUALITY without religions!

  Thank you for that
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  nicolaou

  Pinku/Kalos you were banned from here for a reason. Kindly show enough respect for the site owners decision to leave and not come back.
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  Kalos

  SophieG

  You are wise. This is the way we have to approach life!
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  Kalos

  Magnum,

  You say you lost “over three decades” with JWs! But obviously that was your choice. No one can permit to victimize you without your consent.

  Though we all family members started studying with the Witnesses, I dropped when I finished the 6 th chapter: “Where are the dead?” of the book What does the Bible really teach? When I raised the questions—especially with regard to Jesus’s illustration of Lazarus and the Rich man—something which Jesus would not have coined if he did not believe in a spiritual part that survives the death!!! When they sensed that I did not grasp, they gave me the book Is this life all there is? which also presents the Witnesses’ understanding of the illustration! It made no sense to me. It’s like a preacher who speaks at length on selfless service, yet praise the donations the followers of other Church members give to their preacher!

  I concluded this organization cannot be more wrong than this. The existence of a spirit perceiver is something one needs no proof to accept because of the simple truth that there is no perception without the perceiver who is independent of the things perceived or the act of perception itself [it can choose to perceive or not to perceive at all]—hence perceiver exists before and after the embodiment! Thus 6 th chapter of the book What does the Bible really teach? ended my association with the JWs. Thus I had the fortune of never being disfellowshipped and shunned by them. I also had the fortune of leading some out of JW grip--sharing the above-mentioned concept of INDEPENDENT perceiver.

  Similarly at some point of time, you too might have sensed something is wrong with the JWs, and then and there you could have left the JWs.
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  Finkelstein

  Whatever happened has a lesson for us!

  Yes it teaches everyone that you should never trust men who run and operate their own publishing house, for more than likely they

  will create falsely corrupt doctrines as a means to proliferate their literature to the public and they may even try to get

  people to distribute those pieces of literature in a coercively exploitive way .
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  Magnum

  No one can permit to victimize you without your consent.

  I guess English isn't your first language and you're trying to say that no can victimize me without my consent. If so, then I say you're absolutely wrong. I can give many examples of people including me who have been victimized without consent. Do you believe that all the JW children who were victimized by being sexually abused gave their consent? Do you believe that I consented to the person who broke into my car? Did I permit the guy who sold me the VW station wagon to victimize me? He lied and told me the air conditioner worked; I later found out that it didn't and that it couldn't be repaired - that there was an issue with the design.

  The org did not present the honest truth to me. It hid things about its past. It hid doctrinal matters. It hid many things. I did not consent to being victimized.

  And actually, the JW explanation of the Rich Man and Lazarus made more sense to me than that of those who take the parable literally. The fact you disagreed with their explanation does not mean that any who didn't are wrong. Do you set the standard? Are you that great? I'll argue that parable with you if you want. Do you take it literally? Do you believe in a burning hell? Do you think Jesus was referring to Abraham's being alive and in heaven? If so, then there's a problem. Paul argued in the book of Hebrews that Jesus' death is what opened up the door to heaven. If Abraham was to go to heaven, he couldn't have been there when Jesus spoke the parable.
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  Kalos

  Hi Magnum ,

  I did not proofread what I wrote—hence there was a word in excess, which is an obvious mistake. And you discerned it immediately. That is the way you should have behaved with JWs. When you sensed something is wrong, immediately you could have left them!

  Now, regarding the Illustration of Lazarus and the Rich man! I brought this point as an example of interpretation which makes no sense to me. My point was not about whether the illustration is to be understood literally or prophetically. What matters is what his immediate audience understood. They knew that Jesus was highlighting the “sow and reap” principle which He himself has proclaimed on numerous occasions. (Mathew 10:33 ; 12:35-37; 16:27 ; 23:12 ; Luke 6:37 , 38; John 5:14 …..) Thus illustration graphically picturizes that disregard to others’ suffering would attract suffering “either in this age or in the age to come” (Mathew 12:32 ) (Contrast this with the illustration of Good Samaritan wherein he highlighted caring for the suffering would attract blessings). Jesus will not say something which would require numerous scholars to grapple with and to come out with conflicting conclusions through centuries. (Contrast Mathew 11:29 )! But what is too obvious is that Jesus believed in the immortality of the soul (Luke 20:38 ; Ecclesiastics 12:7); otherwise he would not have made an illustration with the theme of some dematerialized souls talking to each other. If what it really meant as you and JWs take it to be, there were many other ways of explaining it UNUMBIGUOUSLY!!! Why should he CHOOSE dematerialized souls as the key characters?
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  Theredeemer

  I kind of get what you are saying OP but, for many, its not just a total waste it was a traumatic, heartbreaking and dreadful experience with lingering effects. Some are still being slandered, attacked and shunned for leaving which means no real escape. So, yes, its not a waste; its a total fu$%ing nightmare!!