Question for "apostate" couples.

by 3rdgen 31 Replies latest jw friends

  • Sail Away
    Sail Away

    3rdgen, thanks for this thread. I hope you don't mind if I vent.

    I have changed a lot since I left the organization over three years ago. My husband left over thirty years ago and went about living his life, but was not mentally free for all those years. He became a work-a-holic while I raised our children in The Lie. I started challenging him on his indoctrination about a year after I left. He now posts regularly on the ex-JW sub Reddit. I post regularly on the YUKU forum. We often share what we read and post. We don’t often fight over ex-JW issues, but do have heated discussions.

    My husband and I went to marriage counseling for several months until I pulled the plug. The counselor agreed that we were getting absolutely nowhere. My husband grew up with the WTB$ vilifying therapists and psychiatrists. He doesn’t value the process. I had to educate our therapist about JW doctrine. He was shocked by this video:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Wqzc2M8_MBA

    I want an equal say in my marriage; I want transparency in communication and I want emotional intimacy. Early on in the process the therapist was able to identify that these things are missing in our marriage. The therapist gently and repeatedly cautioned my husband to be careful, that he was in jeopardy of losing his marriage unless he is willing to change.

    The therapist told my husband that I am growing; I am becoming empowered. I am no longer depressed and in the role of the identified patient. We have discussed joint decision making and a more “democratic” marriage with little movement in that arena. I still struggle with knowing that my say is of value and carries equal weight. I second guess myself, my thoughts and feelings and my goals. My husband still believes someone in the family has to make the final decisions, and that is his role. He is strongly opinionated, and I have to fight to be heard. It is exhausting and at times demeaning.

    The therapist stated that we have “strong ideological issues”, and that is true. The “theocratic warfare” mindset sickens me. My husband is willing to bend the truth and withhold information if it suits his purpose. I am of the opinion that the members of the GB know it is all a lie. My husband believes that they are lifers who have worked their way up the ladder as true believers. My husband accepts that he was unable to go to college. He likely would have pursued a career in science, but instead became a self-taught computer consultant. I am angry that I turned down a full college scholarship to ”full-time pioneer where the need was great” and that uninformed choice now limits what I can do with my life. College is no longer affordable to be as my husband is very near to retirement. My husband is thankful that he was a full-time pioneer and was exempted from going to Vietnam. Terry’s imprisonment and his treatment there makes me weep. I have no words for that. My husband went to Bethel, but was pretty much an outsider who did his own thing. He didn't last long (2 1/2 years) and didn't see anything there that troubled him. The fact that my in-laws shun my husband and children and yet they forgive a pedophile because “Jehovah forgives him” infuriates me. My husband makes excuses for them. I hold our local elders accountable for the way they handled things after our son’s suicide attempt. My husband’s exit was purely due to doctrinal matters. Mine was both doctrinal and highly personal. There is so much more.

    The therapist asked my husband if he was willing to be vulnerable with me, to let me in and talk about his feelings with me. His answer—“No. I am not a woman. Feelings change all the time. I’m not going to talk about every little thing that bothers me. If something big comes up, I’ll let her know before I make any decisions.” All right then. At times we are both angry and confused. Neither one of us is really happy. I have hit the wall. Starting over at 56 years of age is terrifying. Living this slow death for the rest of the time I have on this planet is equally terrifying. That being said, we have stayed together this long, and I don’t want the filthy cult to win. I've read of other ex-JW marriages that have failed. I often wonder why and if they were struggling with similar issues.

    Our adult children are both of the opinion that our JW life is in the past. They don’t want to talk about it and think we should move on with our lives. I am happy that they got out as young adults and have been able to build happy and productive lives for themselves, but I don’t think they understand the impact of a lifetime of indoctrination.

  • Ucantnome
    Ucantnome

    With my wife and I, I think the difference is in what we feel we lost. I don't think she feels she did lose that much. I feel I lost a lot. She is a lot more relaxed than me. I'm not. So she doesn't need to talk about it.

  • Phizzy
    Phizzy

    At first I wanted to talk a lot, and explain the "ins and outs of a ducks arse" as her father says, about each facet of TTATT.

    She would listen for a bit, then get bored I guess.

    I think we both feel the same about most of it, I think she misses our JW reltives and "friends" far more than I do, and our approach to belief is different from each other now, perhaps always was a bit.

    Mrs Phizzy, as with many of the Female persuasion, approaches most things on an emotional level, how she feels about it. I go for the almost entirely rational approach.

    We don't fall out over any of it though, we are both reasonable, happy people.

  • KateWild
    KateWild

    He doesn't want to be reminded every day because he is bitter, angry. and touchy.-3rdgen

    There are stages of recovery as he has less time and less inclination it seems like he is stuck in the first stage.

    I came out without my husband. He was my ex when I left so I can't speak from that perspective. But My daughter and I left within months of eachother. She has recovered in her own way and we sometimes do argue over JW stuff. One time she got very angry and resentful and I thought she would never speak to me again, but now she has completely worked through it and is really upbeat with me and a chatterbox.

    Everyone is different I suppose, she did start a thread on JWN about her story, but she hasn't been back since then, whereas I feel the need to check in daily.

    Kate xx

  • Emery
    Emery

    sloppyjoe2

    My wife has zero interest in keeping up with anything. she could walk away and never ask a single question about the religion again. I on the other hand keep up on things. The difference though was that she never fully studied even when she believed it. So when there is a big change to something the chances of her knowing what the previous doctrine was is pretty slim. The arguments we have is that we are not fully out yet. She would walk away tomorrow but I need a slower fade because of family.

    You summarized my situation almost perfectly, except we've already left.

  • Still Totally ADD
    Still Totally ADD

    At first my wife was more sure the cult was full of crap for me it took a little longer to come to that conclusion. Now we are always on the same page. For me I could never come here again but my wife loves being on here. What's funny I am the one who post the most where my wife only post once in awhile. Still Totally ADD

  • Simon
    Simon

    It did cause arguments for us when we were first leaving - I think the chances of both people being on exactly the same page at precisely the same time is remote so it's probably inevitable that there will be disagreements and of course the WTS doctrines kind of promote this.

    Fortunately we made it through and we both feel the same way about things now (or close enough that differences don't matter). Neither of us have a great deal of direct interest in JWism anymore although we're both still impacted due to family.

    The main things is to keep talking and reasoning, not arguing.

  • DesirousOfChange
    DesirousOfChange

    Great discussion, 3G.

    My wife is on the same page as far as the WTS/GB/F&DS being a hoax. We both know TTATT. She says that she never believed it all. I did. I believed it all -- hook, line, & sinker. We keep our foot in the door, to maintain family and a couple friendships. So, a meeting maybe once/month plus the Memorial. But most in the Cong are our "former friends". They're bubbly when we bump into them in public because they are so concerned abut us and they love us sooo much, but we never hear from them. No calls. No visits.

    We are in different places on the God vs Evolution issue. She's still totally committed to belief in the Bible & God etc. I think that comes from the fact that we separated the WTS/FB from God & Bible in order to break free from the cult thinking. I would like to be convinced, in fact I'd prefer to be convinced, that the God/Bible belief is true, but I have doubts. Doubts that I refuse to address for the moment. Because if there is NO God, and His Word means nothing, then where does that leave us? That's another battle to be fought and I'm tired of fighting for the moment.

    So, to all you who are struggling to get your spouse "OUT", you'll see that that isn't the end of the battle.

    Good luck to all,

    Doc

  • Julia Orwell
    Julia Orwell

    My husband never wants to talk about it and gets awkward if I bring up the borg. He's not interested in even debriefing his experience. To him it's best forgotten it seems.

  • Sail Away
    Sail Away

    Simon: "It did cause arguments for us when we were first leaving - I think the chances of both people being on exactly the same page at precisely the same time is remote so it's probably inevitable that there will be disagreements and of course the WTS doctrines kind of promote this.

    Fortunately we made it through and we both feel the same way about things now (or close enough that differences don't matter). Neither of us have a great deal of direct interest in JWism anymore although we're both still impacted due to family.

    The main things is to keep talking and reasoning, not arguing."

    Thanks for this perspective.

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