Religion without revelation - any examples from the past?

by EdenOne 23 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  EdenOne

  I'm researching on the common trait of mostly every religion coming from pre-humanist times, and that would be, the notion of "revelation", that is, that at the beginning of every [I say this with caution because I'm admitting to exceptions] religion there is some sort of "revelation" from supernatural being(s) of some sort.

  My question is: Do you know of any example of religions from the past that you can confidently say that were exempt from "revelation", or "enlightenment from a supernatural origin" or "mystical connection with a supernatural world"? This is not the same as asking if there were religions without gods, or religions of nature. I'm not even considering what I understand as philosophical-ethical systems, such as confucionism or platonism. My purpose is to find out if, at the starting point of all religions of the past, there is a "revelation", or merely "observation / contemplation".

  Not sure if I made myself clear, but, in any case, please let's think together.

  Eden
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  Coded Logic

  Jainism is one of the oldest religions and I believe it meets your requirments of no purported revelation, enlightenment from a supernatural origin, or mystical connection with a supernatural world. The worlds oldest known religion, Zoroastrianism, also claims no devine revelation. It's founder, Zoroaster, based the religion off his philosophical views of creation, existance, and the condition of free will.
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  EdenOne

  Coded Logic,

  regarding Zoroastrianism, Wiki states:

  "According to Zoroastrian belief, when Zoroaster was 30 years old, he went into the Daiti river to draw water for a Haoma ceremony; when he emerged, he received a vision of Vohu Manah. After this, Vohu Manah took him to the other six Amesha Spentas, where he received the completion of his vision. This vision radically transformed his view of the world, and he tried to teach this view to others."

  I think this puts a "revelation" or "supernatural enlightenment" at the origin of Zoroastrianism.

  Eden
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  Ruby456

  the way I understand you EdenOne you seem to be talking about sacred biography or hagiography because it is in this genre that a founder is said to hve had a supernatural revelation and who is then considered to mediate/channel this for followers. The reason I am saying this is because i'd like to question and broaden what "revelation from the a supernatural source" means anyway.

  Another point is that observation/comtemplation doesn't convey the shock of insight and then mission that "revelation from the supernatural" conveys. My interest in this is to wonder if what we term non religious motives may be just as powerfully insightful and life changing as what we have come to understand via sacred biography as being revelation from a supernatural source. Then as well how do you separate the two - religious and non religious without losing a sense of the power of inspiration that comes from feeling a sense of calling towards a particular path - for example a person may feel called towards becoming a doctor, or an artist, or a political leader - he/she may not be ambitious for fame and prestige but may want to help people.
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  EdenOne

  Coded Logic,

  As far as I could (superficially) read, Jainism might be regarded as a religion without a "revelation" at its inception - although their devotion to jinas and their elevated view of the tirthankaras sometimes may strike as some sort of 'mystical connection with supernatural [in this case, previously human] beings". But I agree, it may well be regarded as an exception to the norm.

  Eden
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  Coded Logic

  The story you're refernecing about Zoroastrianism was added centuries later and was not part of Zarathushtra's teachings. The Gathas are universally acknowledged to be his actual words (one of very few writings by the actual founder of an ancient religion). So we can seperate the actual person from the legends that followed later. In the Gatha, Zarathushtra never claims nor implies God spoke to him. To the contrary, his poem was a prayer of sorts to the Gods.

  "Zarathushtra's theology is always projected with a moral dimension, Asha always carries the joint meaning of Truth and Righteousness. Thus we comprehend the world as an intrinsically good, divine creation, contaminated by evil, but capable of being perfected by the actions of humans by reason of their capacity of moral choice. Human action can promote good and reject evil leading to its ultimate banishment from the world, though it may continue to exist as a conceptual possibility."

  "The focus of Gathic teaching is one of a world afflicted with suffering, inequity, and imperfection, the goal being to transform it and bring it to perfection, that is, in consonance with Truth, by the comprehending power of the Good-Mind. Such a perfecting world would progressively bring satisfaction to all the good creation. And it would inaugurate the desired kingdom, Khshathra Vairya, where the ideal society would manifest peaceful social existence in which all interests would be harmonized and balanced in a just order, for that is an implication of Asha. This achievement depends on enlightened human thinking and right-minded human resolve."

  - Dr. Kaikhosrov Irani

  Hope that clears things up a bit :)
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  Coded Logic

  Wait, are you looking for a religion whos founder didn't claim revelation? Or are you looking for a religion where its founder wasn't later mythologized? The two are seperate criteria.
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  Kalos

  Good question, EdenOne. The very fact religion allude to some divine revelations is the proof that they themselves find inadequate to attract people, hence they feel the need to resort to some authority (like ancient kings claimed divine right to rule)
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  EdenOne

  Ruby, thank you for your input. I'll tell you where the crux of my interest is: For the sake of argument, let's assume that every "revelation", "mystical connection" and "supernatural enlightenment" can be rationally explained away by altered states of mind caused by mental illness (schizoprenia, bipolar disorder...) induced hypnosis, 'near-death experiences', extreme starvation, or by hallucinogenic substances.

  If every "revelation" / "mystical connection" / "supernatural enlightnenment" may be the result of the factors above, is there ANY religious system pre-humanist that isn't dependant on the factors I have mentioned? That's what I'm aiming to investigate.

  Eden
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  EdenOne

  Coded Logic:

  Wait, are you looking for a religion whos founder didn't claim revelation?

  Yes, exactly. Whatever mythology came to be constructed afterwords by its adherents, it's not relevant as long as it hasn't become a fundamental part of that religion.

  Eden