I guess then we would be thinking of ritual - rituals that reflect environmental concerns - i nominate jainism since it has already been mentioned - the non harm rituals and principles. Mind you these are also found in hinduism, in buddhism, in christianity and Judaism and in Islam too when I think about it
Religion without revelation - any examples from the past?
by EdenOne 23 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
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Viviane
Jainism is one of the oldest religions and I believe it meets your requirments of no purported revelation, enlightenment from a supernatural origin, or mystical connection with a supernatural world.
"According to Jains, souls are intrinsically pure and possess the qualities of infinite knowledge, infinite perception, infinite bliss and infinite energy. [ 28 ] In contemporary experience, however, these qualities are found to be defiled and obstructed, on account of the soul's association with a substance called karma over an eternity of beginningless time"
As soon as the concept of soul is introduced, there is a mystical connection with a supernatural world.
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Band on the Run
You don't state what your problem with relevation; is it a bad thing, in your view. Revelation exists in pagan myths that predate the major religions today. Greek myth is full of them. Native Americans believe in revelation. I see no fundamental problem with revelation It is Revelation, misapplied, that causes problems. Unless you clarify your idea, your research will not yield much.
Many people today use revelation in the sense of new insight. Epiphany is also used, with a small e.
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EdenOne
BOTR, my "problem" with revelation is that it can rationally be disputed as a) product of mental illness; b) product of an induced altered state of mind (hypnosis, drugs, starvation, dehydration, sun stroke, delirium...); c) ad-hoc mythologization; d) deliberate deceit.
My hypothesis is that, at the basis of [most] every religion before humanist age, there is always a "revelation", or a "supernatural enlightenment", or a "mystical connection with the supernatural domain". I would like to know if any religion has developed out of mere observation or thought process that doesn't include the supernatural.
And, Vivian, good observation about Jainism.
Eden
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EdenOne
Ruby:
i'd like to question and broaden what "revelation from the a supernatural source" means anyway.
Perhaps it's best if I give you a familiar example. Judaism, Christianity and Islam are said to be "Abrahamic" faiths. How did Abraham get his faith in the first place? By means of a revelation from the divinity:
Genesis 12:1-4 The Lord had said to Abram, “Go from your country, your people and your father’s household to the land I will show you. I will make you into a great nation, and I will bless you; I will make your name great, and you will be a blessing. I will bless those who bless you, and whoever curses you I will curse; and all peoples on earth will be blessed through you.” So Abram went, as the Lord had told him (...)
I'm not setting a discussion here if Abraham really heard a REAL voice from God, or if he was schizophrenic and IMAGINED to hear a voice from the supernatural realm, or if Abraham invented the whole story, or if this entire story is an "ad-hoc" mythologization from a later period of time. What I mean is: At the beginning of Abraham's faith [according to Genesis, that is; if you read 1 Enoch the story goes considerably different] there's a "revelation" from a supernatural source.
Eden
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Pterist
I think all religions are esoteric, and handed down to us orally and in literature. You are left with reason and observation, the French Revolution, and the deists that founded the new world. ...to be adopted for world peace (tongue in cheek) ;)
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dan-the-man
Buddhism is a possibility... (though, some say it's not a religion) not so much the 'folk religion' aspect as the philosophy or life-approach.
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EdenOne
What about the "enlightenment" of Siddarta Gautama (Buddha)? How did that come about?
Eden
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dan-the-man
I think it came about by Siddhartha considering life, how to avoid suffering... though there are probably different versions.
in one kind of Buddhism, I think there's the saying "if you meet the Buddha on the road, kill him"
another saying, "if they ask you what your teacher is, tell them 'a roll of toilet paper'"
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Vidiot
Band on the Run - "Revelation exists in pagan myths that predate the major religions today. Greek myth is full of them. Native Americans believe in revelation... Many people today use revelation in the sense of new insight. Epiphany is also used, with a small e."
"Revelation" = new insight via epiphany...
...never looked at it that way, but yeah, it's a good comparison.
x
Makes sense that ancient people would credit that kind of thing to the influence of a deity.
Hell, now that I think about it, I did it as a JW.