How could you justify that God killed all firstborn children in Egypt?

by Mr Fool 92 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  AndDontCallMeShirley

  CS: And if I were calling someone on misspelling Ferguson, I’d make darn sure I knew how to spell it.

  But I get the point and you’re right. It was a cheap shot on my part. I apologize.

  Even the best of spellers make mistakes. I didn't notice my typo until it was too late to fix it. If 99.9% of a person's posts are error-free, it seems rather silly to focus on the one misspelled word.

  Apology accepted. Thank you.

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  To your point, CS, what difference does it make to me when people die?? My answer to that question is the same as yours: because "Life is precious". You see, the preciousness of life is not contingent on belief in any particular god, or any god at all. Atheists are no different than any other human in that regard. In fact, I contend there is little basic difference between you and me other than this one main point:

  I, as an atheist, simply believe in one less god than you do. That's it.

  If believing in the god of the Bible makes you feel better, even if most of it cannot be proven, and even if it means accepting without question the more insidious, caustic, indefensible aspects of said god, then I say, 'go for it'. I acknowledge your right to believe whatever you want to believe, and it is neither my job, nor my desire, to steamroll you into submission. Conversely, I have a right to believe what I choose to believe, and I don't need to justify my conclusions to anyone- conclusions I've reached through study, reflective thought, knowledge and what resonates most with my innate humanity.

  And, that position does not in any way diminish my view of the wonder of life and how grateful I am to be here to experience it, now, if only for a blink in the stream of time. Surrendering my intellect to fanciful and, frankly, unprovable notions regarding any allleged existence of deitie(s) does nothing to enhance my own experience- and in fact, frees me to enjoy it even more because I can honestly face reality squarely head-on.
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  AndDontCallMeShirley

  I'll add one further thought:

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  "Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but will welcome you based on the virtues you have lived by. If there are gods, but unjust, then you should not want to worship them. If there are no gods, then you will be gone, but will have lived a noble life that will live on in the memories of your loved ones." -- Marcus Aurelius
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  cofty

  If there is no God, there is no right or wrong. - Coldsteel

  eh?

  True morality is only possible when you get rid of divine law-givers. You believe in morals by divine fiat. This is why you can blithely dismiss genocide as a mere trifle.

  You have disgusting morals.

  Atheism is a prerequisite for genuine morality.
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  Cold Steel

  "Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but will welcome you based on the virtues you have lived by. If there are gods, but unjust, then you should not want to worship them. If there are no gods, then you will be gone, but will have lived a noble life that will live on in the memories of your loved ones." -- Marcus Aurelius

  There is a great truth in this. One of the most pronounced observations by people who have near death experiences is that they are never asked which church they were members of. The first question asked is, what have you done for your fellow man? Again, when all men are judged, they are judged on the light they had and how they applied it to their lives. Someone once said that in the life to come, men are their own tormentors. They can deceive others, but not themselves, nor God.

  True morality is only possible when you get rid of divine law-givers. You believe in morals by divine fiat. This is why you can blithely dismiss genocide as a mere trifle.

  If atheists are correct, then genocide is a monumental trifle. Black holes a thousand light years from here have no opinion one way or the other on genocide. It's only important to those sophomoric little humans who have such a grand opinion of themselves. Worlds come and go out of existence throughout time, but the little pink thing on Planet Earth thinks genocide should shake the foundations of the heavens.

  You are a shallow thinker, Cofty. That’s why your posts are so incredibly arrogant and foolish. You pop in, ejaculate your opinion and leave, thinking you have left grand thoughts. I don’t know how old you are, but I hope when you get out of high school, you’ll learn that opinions are best stated when they’re backed up with something substantial.

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  cofty

  Coldsteel, let's ignore your very poor attempt at ad homenem and try to stick to the subject.

  Could you please define "morality"?
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  Cold Steel

  You see, the preciousness of life is not contingent on belief in any particular god, or any god at all. Atheists are no different than any other human in that regard. In fact, I contend there is little basic difference between you and me other than this one main point: I, as an atheist, simply believe in one less god than you do. That's it.

  Understood. But about preciousness, I just want you to understand that the preciousness of life is only advantageous to us only if we get something out of it that will benefit us. If death robs us of a way to use life’s lessons to our advantage, then all is for naught. The preciousness of life can only be of use to us if we can apply it to the next. If we held a course in electrical engineering, administer a final exam, then shoot everyone in the class, what does it matter how well they did?

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  cofty

  If death robs us of a way to use life’s lessons to our advantage, then all is for naught.

  That is your fundamental error.

  Life is all the more valuable because of it's temporary nature.

  Here we are with our self-awareness in a huge universe and we have, at best, a few decades to experience it. Believers act like children who can't cope with the fact that it will end. They need certainty and promises of eternal rewards. Even more, they need promises that people who are different from them will receive eternal punishment. They don't want the responsibility of making moral decisons so they take refuge in an ancient text despite it's appaling ethics. Faith is like a child's comfort blanket.

  Atheists are more emotionally mature. They accept the reality of their brief chance at life and spend it like every day really matters.

  Please define morality.
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  Heaven

  What if an entity called man invented god?

  That is the big question.

  It is actually the answer.
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  Cold Steel

  Could you please define “morality”?

  Very well. Morality is the attribute, or quality, of honesty, virtue, honor, loyalty, righteousness and steadfastness that exists in the confines of that which is given us by God. Without the latter, which is not mere sophistry, morality changes. Immoral sexual behavior, abortion and a host of other issues become increasingly debatable. If society is able to craft its own definition of morality, it will inevitably fall under the weight of its own immorality. When Jerusalem fell in 70 A.D., the inhabitants of the city all thought they were good people. As is his wont, God warned the people through the apostles and prophets to tell them otherwise. When they then sought the lives of these apostles, they sealed their own doom. Also, please note that the morals in the present day United States are entirely different than those a hundred years ago. Under God, morality doesn’t change.

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  cofty

  that exists in the confines of that which is given us by God

  And how do you know what is moral in a specific situation?

  In other words, how specifically does your idea of morals differ from just making up what you think is right as you go?