my notes from letter read at service meeting

by DB 17 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  DB

  At tonight's service meeting, a letter was read concerning child molestation and the Society's policy.

  To preface, I jotted down notes in the form of a brief outline. Also, the elder reading it said that the letter is primarily directed to jws for the purpose of answering questions that we may encounter.

  Here's my outline:

  God's people are happy, in stark contrast to this world.
  One reason is that we respect Bible's view of sexual matters.
  We abhor child abuse.
  We will not protect abusers, or sheild them from the consequences of their wicked acts.
  We expect elders to investigate every case (report) of child abuse.
  But, we congregation follows Bible stipulation that there must be two or three witnesses to establish a matter.
  No congregation privilages extended to known child molesters.
  Elders are instructed to report abuse when required by state law.
  People have the "absolute right" (my quotation marks for emphasis and to underscore that it is a quote from the letter) to report child abuse to the authorities.
  Since 1981 several articles published dealing with with matter in WT and Awake.
  When circumstances made the need clear, we have strengthened our policy over the years.
  We feel that our Bible-based policy is strong.

  Some additional notes: There were several scriptures cited and read, I did not jot them down.

  Well, I did note 1 Tim 5:19 and 24. These verses were read after the comment abuout the need for two witnesses. Verse 24 is noteworthy: "the sins of some men are publicly manifest, leading directly to judgement, but as for other men, their sins also become manifest later". No comment was made on these verses, but it is obvious that they are used to show the Society's view that elders cannot act unless there are two or more witnesses, or a confession, or two reports of similar misconduct (of conduct of a similar nature).

  Members of the congregation were invited to ask the elders for further clarification if they felt the need, or had any questions.

  I will refrain at this time from adding any personal comments on this letter or my notes.

  Thanks! DB
• 

  Cassiline

  Thanks for keeping us posted DB.

  Still pushing the two witness thing!!! I ask again since when does a molester let others see his/her dirty deeds??

  "People have the "absolute right" (my quotation marks for emphasis and to underscore that it is a quote from the letter) to report child abuse to the authorities"

  I really hope this is the case now, and those who have been abused can press charges but the letter I posted here says the opposite.

  "It is forbidden to take your brother to court"

  First page,
  http://hometown.aol.com/cassilines/myhomepage/photo.html

  Second page,
  http://hometown.aol.com/maximumflash/myhomepage/photo.html

  Thanks again DB!!!!!! Keep us posted

  C

  When the pain of being where we are, becomes greater than our fear of letting go...we will risk and heal and grow.
• 

  DB

  Hi cassiline!

  Yep, the abolute right thing is clearly a change. And change they'd better.

  Now, on to the links you posted.....take care!
• 

  Elsewhere

  I wanted to record the reading of the letter. I showed up at the time posted for the meeting... but no one was there. The KH was empty.

  I'll have to try again next week. The hall shares multiple congregations and the next congregation has its service meeting on Tuesday. (I will also show up for the Sunday meeting incase they read it there) Whew... I may end up attending all five meetings again.

  Did anyone happen to make a recording, or maybe even have a copy of the letter?

  DB, you mentioned that they stressed the need for two witnesses. That is strange. On JW-Media.com they are denying that.

  Application of "Two Witnesses" in the Congregation
  "The assertion has been made that Jehovah's Witnesses take no action when an allegation of child abuse comes to the attention of the elders unless the accusation is verified by two separate witnesses, and that's just simply not true."
  https://www.jw-media.org/releases/default.htm?content=/vnr/default.htm
  https://www.jw-media.org/vnr/2122827332/819163isdn.htm

  "As every one knows, there are mistakes in the Bible" - The Watchtower, April 15, 1928, p. 126
  Believe in yourself, not mythology.
  <x ><
• 

  DB

  geez, another spelling blunder......it's absolute. :)
• 

  Farkel

  : But, we congregation follows Bible stipulation that there must be two or three witnesses to establish a matter.

  Of course, that is utter bullshit. The Flock book plainly states that there does not need to be two witnesses if there is strong "circumstantial" evidence. As an example of that they cited a cases of a man/women spending the night at the house of another man/woman. If a man spent the night with a "known" homosexual that was evidence enough.

  The bottom line is they will (and have) DF'd perfectly innocent people who did spent the night together without having sex on such flimsy evidence, yet demand far more evidence when a little child claimed s/he was raped.

  They are LIARS. Their "two witnesses" rule is not applied universally, and it is definitely applied cruelly with regards to felonious child rape.

  Farkel
• 

  DakotaRed

  *God's people are happy, in stark contrast to this world.

  And here I thought all were God's people. From where I sit, JWs are the unhappiest people trying to look happy.

  *One reason is that we respect Bible's view of sexual matters.

  Ah yes, the old days. When men were men and the sheep were scared.

  *We abhor child abuse.

  But love and coddle the child abuser.

  *We will not protect abusers, or sheild them from the consequences of their wicked acts.

  Ah, and admission of a most needed change?

  *We expect elders to investigate every case (report) of child abuse.

  And why not let the trained professional investigators investigate every report?

  *But, we congregation follows Bible stipulation that there must be two or three witnesses to establish a matter.

  WAIT! Didn't JR Brown say this rule did not apply with accusations of child molestations? Can't these "happy" people make up their minds?

  *No congregation privilages extended to known child molesters.

  But, who determines and makes them "known?"

  *Elders are instructed to report abuse when required by state law.

  If not required by law, then it is not considered a crime? If it is not reported to the superior authorities, how does the molester become a "known molester?"

  *People have the "absolute right" (my quotation marks for emphasis and to underscore that it is a quote from the letter) to report child abuse to the authorities.

  Just like they have the right to vote, take blood and join the military? Of course, doing so is tantamount to announcing your disassociation, also.

  *Since 1981 several articles published dealing with with matter in WT and Awake.

  Then why do they still adhere to their assinine two witness doctrine? Why not let the appropriate authorites handle criminal matters?

  *When circumstances made the need clear, we have strengthened our policy over the years.

  Yet, they still require two witnesses to a witnessless crime? Victims are shunned while molesters are loved and coddled? Victims advocates are disfellowshipped and shunned, while the molesters walk freely about?

  *We feel that our Bible-based policy is strong.

  Strong indeed. Do as we say or face expulsion and death. Rigidly follow the Watchtower or face obliterarion at armageddon. Can't get much stronger than that!
• 

  nancee park

  they think they have good internal investigators but no those are often pedophiles or perverts too. when spies know the other spies devices it does no good
• 

  RedhorseWoman

  People have the "absolute right" (my quotation marks for emphasis and to underscore that it is a quote from the letter) to report child abuse to the authorities.

  Well, of course they do. However, if there were not two witnesses to the act, and the perpetrator denies the charges, will those reporting child abuse to the authorities then be considered guilty of slandering the pedophile and therefore be disfellowshipped for it?

  Ah....the wonders of doublespeak!
• 

  Elsewhere

  Its amazing. When the elders are motivated, they will hide in bushes with binoculars and take pictures. They will even sit in a parked car in someone’s driveway until the "target" comes home so they can "have a little chat... but when it comes to child molestation:

  Elder: "Did ya’ do it?"
  CM: "No."
  Elder: "Ok, sorry we bothered you"

  Elder to Child: "We talked to him, he said that you are lying. Because of your deceitful actions you will be disfellowshipped at the next meeting. (Walks away mumbling “whore”.)

  "As every one knows, there are mistakes in the Bible" - The Watchtower, April 15, 1928, p. 126
  Believe in yourself, not mythology.
  <x ><