PROOF from the WT

by Scorpion 67 Replies latest jw friends

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  waiting

  Dear SC:

  I do understand and agree with all of your points.

  Maybe we don't argue as well as Friend, but when did the Best Debater have anything to do with knowing and loving God? That's what our religion is supposed to do, enable us to love God as He is in the Bible, and His son Jesus. And yes, it's time to critique our own religion, just like they say we should, and draw our own conclusions for our own lives.

  I hadn't thought about your thought on CT Russell. I had read where he referred to himself as the Seventh Messenger, but didn't know who were the first six. 1,2,3,4,5,6,....7? Sounds successive to me. Obviously not through the apostolic succession as taught by the Catholic church....but succession nonetheless. Or is that old lite now? Darn, it's hard to keep them lightbulbs turned to the right power!

  Dear 7, Neat post - has it occurred to everyone that there's been a whole lot of arguing lately - and none among the people who just talk about life, jokes, their beliefs, etc?
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  Seven

  Dear waiting, I hear what your saying about all this arguing. I hope we can all ride it out together instead on going our separate ways. Keep up your sense of humor. I love your posts!
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  RedhorseWoman

  Arguing? Arguing? Who's arguing? I just tried to express an opinion and offer some support....really, really I did. HELP ME!! ARRGGHHHHHHH!!! Thank God I'm not married to the man!!!
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  Andyman

  Hi Friend;

  I am assuming that you are the same Friend from over at H20 and witnesses.net. If not you sure debate the same:).

  I know that most JW's will tell you that Jehovah and Jesus will be the ones to do the judging, but lets be honest here, they tell that to those at the door, or those who aren't JW's. When JW's get together the converstation, in most cases, is that ONLY JW'w will be saved.

  I think that SC has proven his point here very well.

  Like Waiting said, the best debator isn't the issue here. The facts are right here for all to see, and I think that is the issue.

  If you are the same Friend from H20 I would like to say that I do respect your devotion to the society, and though I don't agree with everything you say, I admire your loyalty. But again I believe that loyalty should be for Jehovah, not the organization.

  Take care.

  Andyman:
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  waiting

  Dear Red Horse,

  Absolutely, IN NO WAY, did I mean to infer that YOU were the one arguing. Look at the other posts! Everybody is arguing with Friend!!!!!!

  Why? Because he infuriates us, belittles us and our arguments - and has made this a forum of his arguments. Don't think we don't want to join with you, but most everything you have said about the topic has been covered. He's baiting you and your rising to the challenge - as any good woman would.

  Look at SC, he's quiet, just from pioneering, buys his wife an hour long massage, for Pete's sake - look at his new post!! A page long, angry response (done well) to Friend, who naturally responds to SC just like he does to you, 7, Frenchy, Spectrum, myself, and others to numerous to name (no harm meant by not naming).

  Maybe Friend is not our friend at all........
• 

  Friend

  Andyman

  Yes, I am the same Friend from H2O.

  I know that most JW's will tell you that Jehovah and Jesus will be the ones to do the judging, but lets be honest here, they tell that to those at the door, or those who aren't JW's. When JW's get together the conversation, in most cases, is that ONLY JW's will be saved.

  Yes, what you say is all too true yet it does not agree with the fine distinction taught in the publications of the Society. Too often JWs get overly caught up in their convictions of having a/"the" true association of Christians that they discount Jehovah’s role as Judge. By questioning them you can get them back down to earth to a reasonable degree—at least you can usually do that on the subject of salvation.

  I think that SC has proven his point here very well.

  I respect that that is your view, but SC has neglected to resolve a number of questions asked relative to his point. When he does so successfully then I will also agree with him/her.

  Like Waiting said, the best debater isn't the issue here. The facts are right here for all to see, and I think that is the issue.

  I prefer to stick with facts myself. When SC does that and resolves those questions I mentioned then (s)he and I can continue with the discussion, if they so desire.

  If you are the same Friend from H20 I would like to say that I do respect your devotion to the society, and though I don't agree with everything you say, I admire your loyalty. But again I believe that loyalty should be for Jehovah, not the organization.

  It is a misconception the think I am devoted to the Society. I am devoted to our Creator alone. I have several major divergent views from the Society and they know what they are because I have told them so. Since there is so much misinformation about the beliefs of Jehovah’s Witnesses, perhaps you mistake my debates over those issues as defense of the Society. I have just as often hung the Society’s laundry out for everyone to see it for what it is. Being truthful demands nothing less than that. Rest assured that my loyalty lay in the hands of the only One that can reciprocate it in full measure.

  waiting

  Maybe Friend is not our friend at all........

  Or maybe Friend is a bigger friend than you realize.

  Friend

  Edited by - Friend on 9 June 2000 0:19:23
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  Seven

  Just following the bouncing smilie:[>:(]
  Supercalifragilisticexpialidocious! Even though the sound of it/Is something quite atrocious/If you say it loud enough/You'll always sound precocious/Supercalifragilisticexpialidocious!

  Come on Friend! Sing! That's right. Have the family join in. See. This is fun!
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  Scorpion

  Frenchy,

  You are right on the mark my man! I enjoy your input. Thanks for the additional qoutes in the KMs.
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  Scorpion

  Just wanted to say thank you to everyone on this thread so far, for understanding what I posted about the Society teaching us as Jehovah's Witnesses that we will be the only ones to survive Armageddon. It is clear as clear can get. I myself do not believe this. Yes, I am sticking my neck out disagreeing with the Society on this. I do not believe Jehovah is going to kill everyone that does not belong to our faith. As a matter of fact, I believe Jehovah is going to judge us more than those outside our faith. The reason I say this is because we are supposed to be bringing the good news of the Kingdom of God. This good news continues to change year after year. Those that did not accept this so called good news that were Jehovah's Witnesses, were castigated and seperated from their families and friends and judged as evil for questioning a doctrine that may be looked at today by the WT as unscriptural, even though the WT taught it as truth to us and expected us to teach it to others as truth. Are we not going to reap judgement for teaching lies? Are we as representatives of God doing him a deservice by listening to men and not God himself. The WT organization is a religion that claims to be Gods channel of communication. Did Jehovah communicate to the Governing Body that those of our faith that have doubts and cannot accept a certain teaching of the WTBTS are evil and should be shunned?

  I myself have seen injustice in my congregation by not only the elders but by the CO himself. I in no way am questioning Jehovah. It is the actions of men claiming to represent God that I question. I as of the last two weeks have came to the conclusion that the WT organization is no better than any other religion. The strict adhearance to conform has made me sick. It seems that faith will never be enough to please God as far as the WT is concerned. It also seems that works will never be enough, and believe me I have worked my ass off for the WT in the last four years. I can and will say, NO MORE! My relationship with Jehovah is between me through his Son Jesus. Not through the WT and than Jehovah and than Gods Son. The WT has it backwards and so do we as long as we believe this. I challenge Friend to show me Scripturally where we as representatives of Jehovah must adhere to the WT, especially when we cannot trust all that is or has been taught us. Is it right that we shun those that were disfellowshipped for a difference of opinion? Or is it that we must shun those that do not agree with the WT?
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  Scorpion

  Friend,

  My response to Apostolic succession in this thread was not meant to be a counter argument as you put it. It was meant to be the truth as far as the WT teaches us. Is not this what we are supposed to be teaching, the truth. As far as the arguments in the apostolic succession thread, the points to each of your questions was met. You just did not like the answers or did not want to understand the answers presented. You have tried to not only skew the subject on this thread, but have done the same on the thread about the Society evading taxes and the apostolic succession topic. I left a response to RedhorseWoman on that thread, (Swaggart).

  I enjoy the way you debate. I have dealt with attorneys that think as you. It helps to know the laws of the land, but most of all it helps to understand the laws of Jehovah through his word and obey Jehovah alone, after all, that is what will save us, not a religion. Do you understand that?