Please bear with me , I have never known any thing other than what the JW have taught me all of my life. So all these ideas, theories come and go , and many times , they are just plain stupid. My mind goes way off into left field never to return , which is probably a blessing. But I was wondering , is it possible that Satan , (if there is a Satan) is more powerful than what the Bible tells us. Right now I am doubting the Bible as being truly inspired of God. So I am wondering if , the Bible writers have the whole universal controversary issue completely wrong. Maybe there is more to it than the Bible tells us. I mean it might explain why Satan has been allowed to continue on in his missions. I know the Bible says he was thrown out of heaven and all, but how can you truly beleive that to be 100% true. Any thoughts on who you may think Satan really is, was and what power you think he may have. I know someone said to me that at one time Satan was just as powerful as Jesus at one time. What do you think?
Could God and Satan be the same in power?
by LyinEyes 13 Replies latest jw friends
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joannadandy
If you want to read something cool try Paradise Lost, it can be kind of difficult, but it basically casts satan as the good guy, and god is the bad guy who is too sensitive and strict.
Other stuff to read would be William Blake, The Book of Thel, or Urizen...it's kind of interesting, I think anyway.
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OUTLAW
Satan has X-ray vision,but God can fly and make pastries anytime he wants.I think God has the best super powers...OUTLAW
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RedhorseWoman
Oddly enough, my husband and I were discussing this exact point this morning. As a JW, I had never questioned God's omnipotence before, but in thinking about things, there were several points that give credence to this idea.
After Satan "turned traitor" he was not denied access to Heaven for thousands of years. He pretty much did as he pleased, according to the Bible....commuting between Earth and Heaven, and confronting God on various issues.
Additionally, the whole idea of a Battle between Good and Evil, or Jehovah vs Satan, implies a certain equality in power. Otherwise, why would there need to be a battle? If Satan were perceptably weaker than God, there would be no need to do battle, God could just eliminate Satan and his hordes with a fingersnap.
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JanH
These ideas are indeed among the oldest in the recorded history of religious thought.
It is generally agreed among scholars of religion that Zoroastrianism was an important precursor to monotheistic religions. It calls itself the oldest revealed religion. In this ancient Persian religion, the divine is a power struggle between Ahura Mazda, the good God, and Angra Mainyu, the "devil". Zoroaster (also called Zarathustra) was the near-mythological prophet giving name to the religion.
The polytheistic tribes of Israel were probably first exposed to the ideas of God and Satan, heaven and hell, the soul and eschatology during the Babylonian exile, at a time when Zoroastrianism spread rapidly. In Deutero-Isaiah there are lots of teachings that shows influence from Zoroastrianism, and this is the first place in the Bible that teaches monotheism (as opposed to Monolatry, worship of one deity while acknowledging others).
Judaism, and later Christianity and Islam, inherited the problem of evil from Zoroaster's teachings. All these religions teach that at the end of time, the Good will destroy the Evil, but how they explain why the forces are currently evenly matched differs.
- Jan
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roybatty
Just recently I have also come to this conclusion. I just can't imagine a just, loving and ALL powerful God allowing such wickedness. Can you imagine God sitting in heaven, watching the Nazis run around Europe killing innocent men, women and children? Or closer to home, Him watching the US government commit genocide against the native Americans? No, in my opinion, there is a battle between two powerful beings and we are given a choice as to which side we'll stand on. Maybe there is something to the Asian ying and yang (sp.?). To me the famous JW line "wait on Jehovah" and the JWs inaction is wrong.
Regarding the Bible and it's being written by God. Mr.Moe brought out a good point about 2 Tim. 3:16. Yes, the Bible is inspired by God but does that mean that it is WRITTEN by Him? For example, my son and I go fishing together quite often. I have taught him how to fish. Because of this he could be INSPIRE to write a book about fishing but that is not the same as me writing it. His conclusions about why I like fishing could be right or they could be wrong. The same is true about the Bible. How can anyone read the account of Noah and the flood and take into account what science now knows today and conclude that the account is anything more then a story? Just as Jesus used stories, so do Bible writers.
Edited by - roybatty on 18 June 2002 15:33:28
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TheStar
Jan,
I wish I could somehow take all that great knowledge you hold in your brain and automatically assimilate it into mine (kinda like an episode of "The Outer Limits" I saw once).
Since only recently getting out of dubdum, I'm overwhelmed by all the material I feel I need to read and sort through to come up with my own conclusions about life, God etc. I get a headache just thinking about it. Can you tell me where you started and how long it took you to get where you are now? I thought I would start reading about mythology. Do you think it's a good place to start? Can you recommend any reading?
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Grout
Sure they're equally powerful.
Zero equals zero, after all.
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JanH
Hi Star,
Can you tell me where you started and how long it took you to get where you are now? I thought I would start reading about mythology. Do you think it's a good place to start? Can you recommend any reading?
I have always enjoyed reading about various stuff, especially history. I intended to study history when I started studying at university (after Business School). I was quite disappointed when I looked at the history curriculum, and very impressed at both the curriculum and quality of lecturers at History of Religions. So that is where I stayed, all the way through a BA to an MA. The curriculum was around 6000 pages per term in religion alone, which would add up to 42,000 pages of articles and books on various aspects of religion. Luckily, some of it has stuck to my brain.
Mythology is interesting. Many like reading Mircea Eliade's books on mythology and religious history. In our field, many of his theories have been discredited as unscientific and speculative, but nobody can take away from him that he had great enthusiasm, great communication ability and certainly good knowledge. If you take it with a necessary grain of salt, it is great reading. Click here for an overview of his books. His 2 books on "A History of Religious Ideas" were on my curriculum, as were some of his articles on Shamanism.
Be aware that hardly any field has a lower signal to noise ratio. There is, to put it mildly, lots of junk written about religion. It is probably a good idea to check out who publishes a book, and whether any university studies use it.
Myth is a huge area. If you want to read the myths of particular cultures, it's difficult to beat the original books. E.g. the Bhagavadgita for Hinduism, The Golden Ass for Hellenistic mystery cults (Isis worship to be particular), the Gilgamesh epic for Mesopotamian religion, etc, etc. The Bible fits in here, too, but exJWs often have so much baggage they are unable to read the texts and see what they really say. What helped me unlock the Old Testament as literature was Jack Miles' God -- A Biography.
If you want general ideas about mythology, as opposed to specific examples and interpretations, you are likely to be stuck with entertaining, but speculative, works like Eliade's.
Hope this wasn't too unhelpful
- Jan
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roybatty
Good post JanH and even better recommendations.