``Stumbling Others:'' Another JW Misapplication?

by Room 215 10 Replies latest jw friends

  • Room 215
    Room 215

    Through all my years as a JW, I've always had trouble understanding the JW preoccupation with behavior modification; especially the teachings regarding ``stumbling.'' Why is it that we are expected to pander to the lowest common denominator. I'm thinking in particular about the oft-used example that when we liberal northerners head south into the U.S. Bible Belt and encounter a JW who, influenced by local preguidices, abstains totally from alcohol. We're told that, in order to preserve our relationship with him/her and not to bruise his/her delicate sensibilities, not to drink in his/her presence. Why is it not incumbent upon them to learn tolerance, and learn to appreciate that they should'nt take offense over a lifestyle different than theirs but entirely permissible by Bible teachings.

    Can it not be argued that our abstinence in their presence validates their pregiudices and reinforces their self-righteous intolerance, an intolerance that perpetuates their notion that the quality of their spirituality is superior to ours for the simple reason that they abstain and we don't? And what about when the ``shoe'' is on the other proverbial ``foot,"" i.e when these teetotalers find themselves in New York, Chicago or anywhere north, and in the presence of Christians who invoke their right to consume alcohol in moderation?

    It's my impression that Paul's counsel has more to do with fostering sensitivity to another's feelings than with any rigid rule-making.

    Anyway, my 2 cents.

  • IslandWoman
    IslandWoman

    "Stumbling Others"? ahh yes, now I remember!

    That greatest of all guilts to be avoided at all costs!

    In school - be careful to act properly lest you stumble someone!

    Neighbors - keep that yard perfect lest you stumble someone!

    Field Service - by all means dress and behave as a perfect Christian lest you ........

    In a restaurant - don't drink too much wine lest you ........

    At the assembly - every worldly person in the world is watching be careful lest you.......

    At the beach - at all cost don't show too much lest you ........

    Out with a group of young JW friends - remember to be good lest you.........

    And I tried to do it all.

    Yes, now I remember!

    I guess I just wanted to forget.

    IW

    Edited by - IslandWoman on 28 June 2002 11:59:43

  • Pathofthorns
    Pathofthorns

    It is funny that the ones who always brought up the "stumbling" thing were usually the so-called "strong" (and self-righteous) ones. Most of the "weak" ones I knew couldn't give a damn about half the stuff that was claimed to possibly "stumble" them. If anything was a stumbling block it was the self-righteous attitude of the spiritual elite.

    It says something about their confidence in the flock that they are so paranoid over the stupid petty little things that might "stumble" them. I would say if anything stumbles people out of that organization it is far and away the actions and attitudes of elders.

    Path

  • wholewheat
    wholewheat

    You mentioned Paul but you didn't mention Jesus. he said 'If your hand stumbles you, cut it off, and if your eye stumbles you, pluck it out.' This shows that stumbling your fellow man is a serious offense. Sometimes, when you show respect for others in areas where they are sensitive you can open the door to teach them about God's Kingdom. Upsetting them will surely close any door of opportunity.

  • NeonMadman
    NeonMadman

    You mentioned Paul but you didn't mention Jesus. he said 'If your hand stumbles you, cut it off, and if your eye stumbles you, pluck it out.' This shows that stumbling your fellow man is a serious offense.

    Actually, it shows no such thing. Jesus wasn't talking in that verse about things you might do that would stumble others, he was talking about conditions that you allow to exist in your own life that would stumble you. In effect, he was saying to be hard on yourself, to hold yourself to a high standard. This is the opposite of what the JW's tend to do. They try to hold others to a high standard, in many cases, a standard which is not even required by the Bible.

    Now, a few verses above that, Jesus also said,

    "And whoever welcomes a little child like this in my name welcomes me. But if anyone causes one of these little ones who believe in me to sin, it would be better for him to have a large millstone hung around his neck and to be drowned in the depths of the sea. "

    Read in context, we see that the direct application was to children, not to adult fellow Christians who should be able to stand on their own two feet, spiritually speaking. I suppose that, by extension, we could make an argument that he was also speaking of spiritual 'babes,' ones who lacked Christian maturity and who might be led astray by improper actions of more mature ones. But the "stumbling" was not the mere causing of offense, or engaging in behavior by one Christian that would not be permitted by the conscience of another Christian. It was conduct that would actually lead a fellow Christian into sin -presumably a less mature Christian who did not know any better, but was imitating the behavior of a respected peer.

    Such occasions are far more rare than the teaching of JW's would make them. I agree with Room 215 about

    the oft-used example that when we liberal northerners head south into the U.S. Bible Belt and encounter a JW who, influenced by local preguidices, abstains totally from alcohol. We're told that, in order to preserve our relationship with him/her and not to bruise his/her delicate sensibilities, not to drink in his/her presence. Why is it not incumbent upon them to learn tolerance, and learn to appreciate that they should'nt take offense over a lifestyle different than theirs but entirely permissible by Bible teachings.

    Indeed, the Christian who insists that others refrain from permissible conduct, simply because they personally do not approve of it, is the one who is spiritually immature and who needs to adjust his or her attitude. Otherwise, Christians would really have no freedom to do anything at all apart from religious activity, because, without a doubt, someone, somewhere would find that conduct - whether drinking alcohol, eating meat, going to the movies, watching TV, dancing, playing cards, etc.etc. - objectionable and would potentially be "stumbled" by it.

    And this, I believe, is exactly the reason that the Watchtower teaches about this issue as it does. It is a control mechanism. In everything he does, the JW must constantly be watching out for any action that might "stumble" someone else. And the result is that nothing, except for approved religious activities (meetings, field service, etc.) can be done with a completely clear conscience. Even healthy recreational activities, which would normally be viewed as a positive thing, are clouded. ("Well, brother, did you really have to take your family for that picnic in the park for the whole afternoon last Sunday? Wouldn't it have been better to have put a few hours in field service first and then enjoyed a shorter picnic?")

    The ironic thing about all of it was pointed out by Pathofthorns:

    It is funny that the ones who always brought up the "stumbling" thing were usually the so-called "strong" (and self-righteous) ones. Most of the "weak" ones I knew couldn't give a damn about half the stuff that was claimed to possibly "stumble" them. If anything was a stumbling block it was the self-righteous attitude of the spiritual elite.

    That's an incredibly good point. In 30 years in the borg, I can't think of a single instance where a new one got discouraged and left the truth TM , or where a Bible study stopped their study, because they saw someone going to an R-rated movie or drinking alcohol. But I saw plenty of people leave because of the self-righteous, arrogant and judgmental attitudes prevalent in the congregation.

    In effect, it's a form of political correctness. In my experience, if you tell an ethnic joke, the one who will become most offended by it is usually some self-righteous PC type who is not even a member of the group supposedly being offended. Likewise, the JW's most worried about who would be stumbled by any given action are the ones who would never be stumbled by the conduct of another JW, and who, ironically, are most in danger of stumbling others because of their unchristian attitudes.

    Edited by - NeonMadman on 28 June 2002 13:9:12

    Edited by - NeonMadman on 28 June 2002 13:12:14

  • Room 215
    Room 215

    I believe that such preoccupation with another person's conduct by JWs derives from the near-worshipful emphasis they place on membership,,or COLLECTIVE worship, which usually impedes the cultivation of a PERSONAL relationwhip with God and Christ, lipservice notwithstanding.

    That's why they fret over whether a neophyte's bad experience with someone associated with their organization will deter him/her from continuing to associate WITH THE GROUP. On the other hand, a Christian with a strong sense of personal involvement with God and Christ is unlikely to draw any negative inferences about these spiritual entities because of any lapses of conduct or manners by othes of their professed worshippers.

  • DakotaRed
    DakotaRed

    Just more Watchtower gobbeldy gook, as far as I am concerned. The very ones expressing this view seem to have no problem stumbling others themselves. There is no limit as to how far you could carry stumbling others.

    I even remember a talk at an assembly years ago where it was said that if an elder stumbled you, then it was your fault. How's that for stumbling others?

    Lew W.

  • Farkel
    Farkel

    Room 215,

    : It's my impression that Paul's counsel has more to do with fostering sensitivity to another's feelings than with any rigid rule-making.

    I'd bet that was Paul's impression, too!

    Farkel

  • BluesBrother
    BluesBrother

    Room 25

    " Why is it that we are expected to pander to the lowest common denominator. "

    Quite right , really it is just a way of getting others to do what YOU want - manipulation by guilt trip.

    Neon,, Brilliant

  • rmayer32
    rmayer32
    their self-righteous intolerance

    That says everything in regards to "Stumbling" among the JW's I think.

    -Rick

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