I NEED your advice!!!!! Please reply! (page 3)

willy_think

Worldly girl,
I don't know what you should do. I would like to tell you that your mother is abusing you. she is manipulating the feelings of your family in order to gain access to your daughter whom she will then abuse emotionally and maybe allow other abuse as well. She will use her to gain back control of her son and with any luck you. I wish I've never seen it before, but I have and I'm seeing it right know. I believe your mother is a bad lady, a truly bad association.

Solace

I know exactly what you mean.

When my kids spend any time with my family, they come home talking about Jehovah and how all other religions are false. Thank God I live across the state so they cant get their claws into them very often. My worst nightmare would be for my children to become indroctrinated by my J.W. family. I feel ill just talking about it. Im sorry I dont have any answers for you since Im going through it myself. Its so sad but I do find that keeping them at a safe distance seems to help.

COMF

It could be worse, hon. They could be shunning you. Sounds like you're the one doing the shunning. Are you sure that's in keeping with your goals? It might do your perspective some good to watch the movie, "Terms of Endearment".

worldly girl

COMF: That's just it, they are shunning ME. Not my worldly husband, or my "worldly" daughter... BUT ME. The try to justify it by saying "when you come back to Jehovah, this will be resolved", all better if you will. BUT the funny part is I'm not DF'd and I've not DA'd myself..... so what justification is there in that?

To me, the worst kind of discrimination is that of a mother to her child. She is shunning me, and even by her religion's rules, I'm not in a position to be shunned.... It's that whole "conditional love" thing.... Honestly, for me, just like w/ friends I've had in the past, if I've realized that they aren't healthy (mentally speaking) relationships for me, I tend to sever the ties..... Morally I do not think it's wrong, because I'm making the choice to have more positive influences in my life, I'm not being told by my religion that I can't have a relationship w/ them... does any of this make sense?

WG

Edited by - Worldly Girl on 23 August 2002 9:8:29

Tinkerbell4125

Worldly Girl,

You can't control what your parents are going to do or how they are going to react, BUT you sure can control how YOU react to and what you do in situations! How can they possibly protect the best interest of your daughter, when they didn't do the same for you!!!

Darlin, you know what to do. It's so hard I KNOW, but there comes a time when you have to say to yourself, enough is enough. You have to take care of yourself, and if that means limiting your association with you j.w. family, then that's what you have to do. Your not alone in this situation. Most of us here are learning the hard way that the best way to take care of ourselves, is too limit, if not completely stay clear of our j.w. families. I have found many times that when I try to get to close, I only get burned!!!

You take care of YOU and you take care of your baby. Learn to get a new life and build a new family structure with other people! I've done it and will coninune to do so. It will never be easy, but if you want to keep your sanity, I would!!!

Cyber hugs to ya girl!!!!!!

sunshineToo

WG, I'm sorry to hear about your mom. {{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{WG}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}

I am going through a similar situation. In my case I don't have children yet, but I'm getting married soon. I've been thinking about what will happen if I have a child.

All of these advises from DB friends are good. Regarding the molesters in the org., I would tell mom not to take my child to the field service, meetings or even their gatherings. But for visiting her friends, maybe if she can keep her eyes on her all the time. I think I can hear her voice yelling at me already. I don't trust those JWs anymore, but at the same time I don't want to deny my mom's status/right to be a grandma to my child, either. I had such a fond memory about my grandma. So I don't want my child to miss it out. As far as religion, I think I'm going to enroll my child to other church.

blacksheep

Wise words, Tinkerbell. You summarized beautifully the issues I'm also in the process of learning. And WG, I know I keep saying this, but your situation/feelings are so similar to mine, right down from DH commenting about my personality/attitude changing after I'm around/speak to my JW family. Eerie.

I've pretty much laid it on the line to my sister that I'm not going to accept the one-way shunning/manipulative behavior that the JW's in my family dole out. They'd like to see my kids (on their terms of course), while shunning/manipulating me. My sister's joined at the hip to my mother, so I'm sure she's shared my comments with my mom.

It really causes you to do some soul searching and evaluate just what is acceptable/not acceptable in family relationships. If you feel bad, if you feel put down, left out, shunned, ignorned, abused, manipulated, etc., why in the world should you feel obligated to continue to expose yourself AND the rest of your family to the same people??? What can you reasonably expect???

Anyway, I think it is really hard for some people who've never intimately been around JWs to understand the dilemma that many of us face. Few families that I know of draw life/death lines that JW's do, as in "you've turned away, you'll die at Armageddon. And so will your family if you don't return to being a JW. Furthermore, everything you do outside of being a JW is doomed to failure."

From my perspective, it's hard to forgive and accept that kind of black/white thinking. Either from family or from anyone else. So, like others have said, I need to protect myself and do what's best all around. I cannot worry about nor control them (or their emotions). Plus, they haven't seemed to be overly concerned with my feelings.

blacksheep

Ack!! I forgot. One practical suggestion I wanted to share with you, which I gleaned from reading a few self-help books on relationships with parents: this one I think comes from the book "Toxic Parents" by Forward(?)

When it comes to maintaining/continuing a relationships which highly toxic/dysfunctional families, you basically have 3 options, depending of course, upon your family.

1) Some families, when appropriately and constructively confronted with their unacceptable or problematic behavior DO make an effort to work with you, understand your feelings, and make changes. In such cases, a good relationship can be built from a previously broken one. As the book noted FEW families achieve this, sadly. (And I think we know where most JW relatives would fall when talking about "change"....)

2) You maintain a distant, but polite relationship with them. This means basically a superficially pleasant relationship, avoiding hot buttons, unpleasant topics, etc. Obviously, this takes the cooperation of you PARENTS to achieve this. If they do not maintain a pleasant relationship by continuing to say or do hurtful things or things you have clearly asked them not to do, such as indoctrinating you daughter, all bets are off. You go to number 3.

3) Pretty much avoid all contact with your family/parents. Save youself the bother and turmoil.

So, sounds to me you are close to where I am, between 2 and 3.

I thought this was helpful/useful to see that at least, with all our JW dysfunction, we're NOT alone in struggling to maintain a reasonable relationship with our first families. And, even the experts recognizes that many dysfunctional family relationships have to be pretty much stopped (or relegated to simple polite, occasional interchanges). HTH (at least a bit!)

Tinkerbell4125

Thank ya blacksheep =;o)

I wanted to add.....

My mother didn't speak to me for almost 10 years! When I found out she was dying of cancer, I got myself reinstated. I thought I could handle the whole j.w. situation thing. Boy was I wrong! I disasociated myself, told the elders to LEAVE ME ALONG, didn't want to be a j.w. It was another disapointing time for me and my mom. It was tough when she died knowing that I had disapointed her once again. Before she died I asked her if she was afraid of not recovering. Her reply to me was, the only fear that she had was not seeing all her children in the new system of things. Talking about ripping your heart out of your chest. It took me awhile to process that one! The one thing that I made sure of though and the one thing that I have made clear with all my j.w. family is that I loved them. I stopped my hostile attitude and worked passed the j.w. bullcrap., and now when I see my j.w. family, I show nothing but love...BUT I still protect my feelings and take care of myself. I hate the WTS, but I don't hate my family. I've learned not to take their j.w. attitude personal. I'm not gonna let all this change ME, I'm gonna show the love thats in my heart.

So you see, we all can relate to each other in so many ways. First and formost, take care of yourself. And the bottom line with my mother, no matter what we were going through at the end of her life, she knew without a doubt that I loved her. I had to live my life, but I loved her.

worldly girl

Blacksheep: You know I really need that book... Thanks for suggesting it to me! To be honest I really think that I'm more on the lines of option 3... Option 2 just doesn't appeal to me, because I have a hard time being fake and putting on the "we're such a loving family" facade even if it is for an hour or so every once in awhile... That's one thing I HATE about JW's... and people in general.

Tink: I deeply admire your strength, I just don't know if I have that strength anymore, I'm tired of the constant emotional games that they play....My family has a history of "cutting someone off" when they disagree, so I don't think that it is an option... they're pretty "all or nothing".

New Developments: My not all there sister in law who is trying to play "save their family", has just asked if we would allow her to take my child with her and my nephew to my parents house for the day.... Did I mention that up until a few months ago, my parents could not stand her, and she and I have never been on good terms. So needless to say, I never had to answer her voicemail, because my nephew is sick now.... whew that was close... See that's my problem, I tend to just put it off, because when I face, I usually end up depressed, for awhile. THIS SUCKS

Oh well... I hope everyone has a GREAT weekend!

WG

I NEED your advice!!!!! Please reply!

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