DESTROYED ! (page 4)

Derrick

I was hoping that my post would clarify that the Bible's teachings and the Watchtower's teachings regarding the reasons God destroys evil people do not necessarily coincide.

Perhaps I should have shortened the post and simply asked the question: How many of you would object to God destroying modern-day dictators who walk in the footsteps of Adolph Hitler, and also destroying serial killers and other hardened criminals, at the war of Armageddon?

Furthermore, the Watchtower may have taught that anyone who isn't one of Jehovah's Witnesses in good standing could face destruction, but reform is all about correcting erroneous interpretations!

Finally, I also think some of you are ascribing to God evil from perceptions of primitive Israelite Bible writers. Consider that God has lovingly tolerated millenniums of evil to ultimately save mankind through the sacrifice of his beloved son, Jesus Christ.

Based on your replies to my post, I'm reminded of the old cliche that "what we have here is a failure to communicate."

Farkel, I will add that learning is not one-sided. I have learned much from you that has given me a wider worldview. Like it or not, you too have learned much from me, and that experience has changed your life forever. As for my recent post, you simply failed to "read between the lines" and understand exactly my points.

ARoarer wrote:2Peter 2, when it speaks about "false teachers" entering into the congregation speaking abusively of the angels must be referring to the CO who spoke to you, and the other elders who like to slander the angels. One of the ways they do this is by calling themselves the "glorious ones" mentioned in Jude, when in fact, this scripture is speaking about the angels. It is the Watchtower who teaches this false doctrine of calling thier leadership the glorious ones and identiying anyone who speaks abusively of them as "Korah". Your CO should do his research.

Sad, but true. Reformation has its work cut out for it.

Derrick

emancipated

I particularly liked the part in the bible where Mr Loving God allowed 'his' people to steal and rape the little virgin girls after slaughtering their father, mother, and siblings. But of course, only the virgins. Wonder how they checked .....

Or the one where he was killings tens of thousands of 'his' people until one dude stuck a sword in a ladies genitals.

I would like to know where in the Bible it speaks of these things you mention. NameWithHeld

NameWithheld

I don't have specific vrs right now (all JW books boxed up). But all you have to do is read ANY of the accounts of Isreal's conquests on the 'pagan' nations. They were mass-killing people right and left. Or for a quick course scan through the "My Book of Bible Stories" (a scary book made for kids) and it will get you to the 'good parts' quickly.

The genital peircing was when the Isrealites were wandering the wilderness, they got mixed up with Midianite(sp?) women, and god started scorging them by the thousands until Phinieas(sp?) stuck one of the men/women in the privates.

Cicatrix

The one thing that I love about this board is the freedom we have to talk about anything we wish with people who have lots of different belief systems.You have the opportunity to post your opinion, and so do others.Critical thinking is encouraged here also.After years of "mental regulating"(ie, if it doesn't fit with the JW program, you better not even THINK it), I find this a place of respite.

I personally started a thread concerning the wisdom of Solomon, which turned into a discussion of another question I had about the Genesis account and free will.Was I looking for an opportunity to deny the exsistence of God and Christ so I could indulge in immorality with a guiltless conscience?Not that I know of.I simply had questions that have bugged me for years(since before I was JW) and I wanted to discuss them.Lots of folks posted, and I learned a lot.I don't think anyone was trying to "sway" me to believe as they do.They were just posting how they personally felt. That's how conversations work.Sometimes people feel strongly about their stance and defend it. That's how communication works, too.

The thing that I had a problem with was your automatic assumption that those who don't believe in God and Christ take that stance simply because they wish to live an immoral, selfish lifestyle. You said that not only do they do this, they also try to get others to join them.You mentioned AIDS alot, as if it is some kind of punishment meted out to only those who transgress biblical law.You know, this is the same stuff you hear from the platform week after week at the meetings.It's a pretty weak arguement, designed to scare anyone who questions into compliancy.And it makes me question even more if there really is any such thing as free will.If there were, why would you feel the need to attack those who feel differently with such blanket stereotypes? If your God is the All Knowing Supreme Ruler,can't you just let them believe and live as they wish and let your God figure it all out? But with organized religion, it never seems to work that way, does it?

From one who has been DESTROYED many times by many people of many religions.

Derrick

It's a pretty weak arguement, designed to scare anyone who questions into compliancy.

The real purpose of its "design" from my standpoint is not with the intent to frighten people, but to share what I know with them. I believe this helps people start to ponder what is God's true purpose for creating us, and to seriously think about the age old question "is this life all there is?"

And it makes me question even more if there really is any such thing as free will.If there were, why would you feel the need to attack those who feel differently with such blanket stereotypes?

God created free will for a purpose. That purpose was not to give an ultimatum to people as much as it was to give people freedom to act within the law. People in democratic countries understand that true freedom includes necessary laws in order to protect everyone. God's laws are similar, not designed to oppress but designed to maintain peace and security for everyone, and protect the right of all living people and all living things to live free lives to the fullest.

If your God is the All Knowing Supreme Ruler,can't you just let them believe and live as they wish and let your God figure it all out?

Through the pages of the Bible, the true God of the universe asks those who benefit from its wisdom to share that wisdom with others. That doesn't mean cramming it down their throats but simply sharing, just as they might share their beliefs with ourselves. Mutual respect for all beliefs is tenamount to true Christianity. Sadly the Society has been slow in learning this important lesson, but give them time. One must learn to "walk" before they can "run"!

But with organized religion, it never seems to work that way, does it?

No, it sure doesn't. That is why Pastor Charles Taze Russell, founder of Zion's Watch Tower magazine in the late 1800's, publicly declared that "religion is a snare and a racket!" to the angst of many (but not all) in Christendom's clergy class.

I appreciate your thoughts.

Derrick

RandomTask

But the problem is that your witnesses have strayed so far from the original intent of just studying the bible as C.T. Russel first started the group, to becoming a full blown fundamentalist cult with a plethora of rules and regulations which add "the wisdom of men" to what is written in the bible.

Derrick

RandomTask wrote:But the problem is that your witnesses have strayed so far from the original intent of just studying the bible as C.T. Russel first started the group, to becoming a full blown fundamentalist cult with a plethora of rules and regulations which add "the wisdom of men" to what is written in the bible.

Perceptive. What would you suggest is the answer to get this derailed train upright, back onto the tracks, and moving foward in the right direction again?

Derrick

Farkel

: Perceptive. What would you suggest is the answer to get this derailed train upright, back onto the tracks, and moving foward in the right direction again?

A carefully placed thermonuclear device at their world headquarters. They are thoroughly evil and you are engaging in wishful thinking. New wine in old wineskins and all of that. Don't you believe what Jesus said said about wine and wineskins?

: Like it or not, you too have learned much from me, and that experience has changed your life forever.

Would you like me to elaborate on that?

: As for my recent post, you simply failed to "read between the lines" and understand exactly my points.

That's a big difference between us, Rick. I write ON the lines and you write BETWEEN them. Try writing ON the lines next time. When you do that, it makes your writing much more comprehensible. You don't write stuff ON the lines and then expect people to understand what what you wrote ON the lines is NOT what you meant, but what you meant was what you DIDN'T write ON the lines, but what you DIDN'T write BETWEEN the lines and then expect people to figure out what you wrote wasn't what you wrote, it was what you DIDN'T write that you want people to "discern."

This is just too confusing for a schmuck like me.

Farkel

Edited by - Farkel on 1 November 2002 21:29:27

Jesus Christ

So, uh, derrick, you never did answer me? Is my going on about how I (Jesus Christ, the guy who did not die for idiots like you) many times I got laid and wasted back when I was on earth enough to get me destroyed? If so, I really need to get out more and cause more havoc. Hey, what's the worst that'll happen to me? I'll be destroyed when your petty version of dad kills all the bad folks like me? Eh, fair trade. At least that way I won't have to spend an eternity with a bunch of self righteous cult members who are boring as hell.

Farkel

namewitheld,

: particularly liked the part in the bible where Mr Loving God allowed 'his' people to steal and rape the little virgin girls after slaughtering their father, mother, and siblings. But of course, only the virgins. Wonder how they checked .....

Leviticus 31. It's a classic in the long saga of Jehovah's "spirit-directed" genocide.

Farkel, who wonders how they "checked," too

DESTROYED !

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