Will Child Abuse Issue Keep Growing Like A Forest Fire?

by OnTheWayOut 10 years ago 50 Replies latest 10 years ago watchtower scandals

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  OnTheWayOut 10 years ago

  It looks like this is a firestorm of thought as so many responded. I had to click send before I finished typing. But enough was said. Let me respond to some.
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  StarTrekAngel, even short of a hearing in other countries, I hope that just hearing of a ruling against WTS in another country will be enough to push it past the allegations stage.
  
  truthseeker100, I imagine it will eventually be on the PBS type of international news. I really hope it makes CNN more and more. I know it already did. I really picture most JW's as more the CNN type.

  OrphanCrow, great comments on "the trigger." Exciting times ahead.
  
  LITS, I can imagine ex-JW's not wanting to talk about it. Heck, it wasn't my issue at all when I came out of it. I assumed it was exaggeration when I first heard about it. But facts are facts and I was naive. Your focusing on Bill Cosby like that, I think we are on the exact same page. Enough accusations should equal at least a consideration that it's not just a bunch of lawsuit-happy people. It should merit attention to see if it has any truth, even to a JW. It would have gotten my attention were I still "in."

  Phizzy, we don't want to forget victims. This thread was mainly about wildfire spreading through the rank and file, but you are right. I will be satisfied if many more victims get some kind of closure. Settlements and/or a day in court would be nice for them. WIldfire is a bonus.

  Mad Sweeney, I hope they do "follow." I don't mind being last, as long as they follow.

  John Aquila, that would be cool. But aside from his homophobia, tight pants and spanx comments, I doubt any such thing is true about Tony Morris. Now, if we heard a rumor about him liking to put on tight leather and being tied up with leather straps while his wife gets out the whip, I would probably think it was true.

  TheWonderofYou, I always thought just like you. If "they" can forgive a child abuser, he should be content to be an inactive JW and stay away from the kids. Part of the problem with WTS is they don't want to even admit that circumstances for such a situation exist. Further, they don't want to create a new level of membership where being "inactive" is not only allowed but it is mandated. And as far a therapy goes, the local elders might be caving in more and more on the idea that people need professional therapy, but Watchtower itself is a long way from considering encouraging it openly.
  

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  TheWonderofYou 10 years ago

  Permanent abuse commission (handling the abusers)

  This commission is permanently tracing the abusers and watching their progresses, also to help them fighting against their bad behaviour in cases where that is possible.

  There are thousand of victims and thousands of abusers/pedophiles.
  It will be a very very diffiult job to work with them. but if they go to the jail too to find criminals to convert, they should be able to help those ill people too and make separate congregations in camps or recovery centers.

  The permant abusers commission shall work togehter with police.

  Trained sisters or brothers who are policemen, shall educate and help these people to be a helpful part of our society. Even in these abusers/pedophile centers will be spiritual help of the Body. and the communtion with other brothers and "sister?" will help them. Of course family members are allowed to come togehter with the abuser. But not in the frame of the old congregations where they were before daily confronted with victims.
  

  
  

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  DesirousOfChange 10 years ago

  So often, I think WE are guilty of looking at things related to JWLand with the midset of "wishful thinking". We would like think that Candice Conti would have a huge impact. But it really didn't. A few of the R&F took note, but it wasn't an earthquake or forest fire.

  The Commission investigation may prove to be a forest fire in Australia, but that's doubtful if it will spread to the US. Most Americans can't see past their property lines (NIMBY) let alone see anything going on in the rest of the world.

  But if the attorneys who are watching for the results in the lawsuits (like Conti) are following the Australian investigation and incriminating things are exposed, resulting in dozens or hundreds of new lawsuits being filed in the US Court system, then you will have your wildfire!

  Follow the money.

  Doc
  

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  done4good 10 years ago

  DesirousOfChange - So often, I think WE are guilty of looking at things related to JWLand with the midset of "wishful thinking". We would like think that Candice Conti would have a huge impact. But it really didn't. A few of the R&F took note, but it wasn't an earthquake or forest fire.

  The Commission investigation may prove to be a forest fire in Australia, but that's doubtful if it will spread to the US. Most Americans can't see past their property lines (NIMBY) let alone see anything going on in the rest of the world.

  While I agree with the "wishful thinking" element, there is more to this than an isolated case. No one case is going to make that big of an impact, however, these cases are getting noticed, and it weighs on the minds of the R&F in the form of cognitive dissonance. CD always has a breaking point, at least in aggregate. It will take time, but many will wake up because of this reporting.

  We need to stop looking as these things as the one big thing that will bring the org. down. That will not happen. I say this over and over, this is about social evolution. Our society today is not tolerant of protecting a religious organization at the expense of innocent children and their families, thank goodness. At one time, it was common for these types of things to be swept under the rug because it was "too unspeakable" to be mentioned. That is precisely why religious organizations and other organizations got away with this problem for so long. Society no longer tolerates this.
  

  All of this is about the big picture. The WT organization looks very, very, foolish being on the wrong side of this argument. JWs will naturally want to distance themselves from it. It is human nature. Just like any other tragic learning, the initial response by JW will be that of denial and disbelief, (cognitive dissonance), however eventually, with enough reminders and persistence, the CD will be begin to wear on them, at which point they will need to accept facts. This tipping point takes place when it becomes less painful to adjust to the new knowledge, rather than trying to support the old in vain.
  

  d4g
  

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  OnTheWayOut 10 years ago

  Some replies from page 2:

  TheListener, as glad as I am to hear that these cases are hurting Watchtower, I fully agree. I would rather that nobody was a victim, and I would trade all the pain for just letting Watchtower keep their money. But it's out there because it did happen, so I hope as many victims as possible get some closure and I hope it hurts Watchtower as much as possible, because that hurt is still less than what a victim goes through.

  TheWonderofYou, so true. The U.S. is afraid to step in against religion anymore than financial rewards. Let's hope for Australia, UK, others to do more.

  "Therapy at our cost" ????? No thanks. It would have strings attached- JW counselors or reports back to WTS along with the bills. Better to just give them enough money to find their own genuine no-strings therapy. Your humor situation of educated sisters and victims sounds even worse. Humor is right. Ha ha. I like the ACCC.

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  Mad Sweeney 10 years ago

  Anything that slows their growth, helps more victims, and protects more people from becoming victims is a good thing. If ONE person stops studying, it's a win. And these things often end up with dozens if not hundreds of people leaving the Borg. Mass exodus? Perhaps not. Still, baby steps...

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  My Name is of No Consequence 10 years ago

  If it has to do with the harming of children, you better believe that this issue will keep growing and eventually will explode. Remember Penn State and Jerry Sandusky? It started out with a few allegations and emails. Later on, victims started coming forward and sharing their stories and then it all exploded. The difference is that there was only one monster and a few enablers at Penn State. In dub land (as well as many other so-called religions), there were and are 100's or even 1,000's of "Sanduskys". Years after all of the allegations were made known, the university still trying to recover from it and will never be the same.

  Yeah. This thing is going to explode. It's happening right now.

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  OrphanCrow 10 years ago

  OntheWayOut: OrphanCrow, great comments on "the trigger." Exciting times ahead.

  The way I see it is this:

  Barbara loaded it, Candace cocked it, and now the trigger has been pulled.

  Not to downplay and not give credit to all the other victims who have struggled to tell their stories over the years, but but those two voices have been so prominent in the team that has come forward so far. They have led the way, for sure.

  Now, a whole country is listening and not only that, people from around the world have access to live feeds. This is so critical - we don't have to rely on written transcripts or other people's versions of events - each and every one of us all over the world have been empowered. We each can find our own positioning in the events - with our own eyes and ears and make our own decisions. We have been freed by the efforts of many.

  Now, the gun was loaded, cocked, and the trigger has been pulled. This could very well, through the power of media, and the courage of all, turn into an automatic machine gun fire.

  Keep talking. People are listening.

  This is not just for those still trapped and harmed inside of the JW religion. It is for everybody everywhere.

  I have a little piece of paper glued to one of my collages. I tore it off the bottom of a letter a dear friend of mine wrote to me shortly before he died of the horrible consequences of PTSD. He had served two tours in Afghanistan and he will always be my hero. The words on that piece of paper say this, written in his beautiful handwriting:

  "Act With Courage"

  
  

  
  

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  Doubting Bro 10 years ago

  I agree this is going to get even bigger. When I was an elder, I remember all those abuse letters and wondered with other folks if there was an issue or they were just being cautious. I also distinctly remember after the 20/20 report I was a bit shaken. I personally never had to deal with the issue either myself or within my family from another JW. So I assumed these things were isolated issues.

  But, I do remember the subject coming up in a car group in service. I also remember saying to the entire group that it was rape and a crime and crimes should be reported to the police. I used the murder example and said if you witnessed a murder, your first call should be to the police and then you could talk to an elder or whatever about it. Same with child rape. Everyone in the group agreed. To me, it wasn't being a rebel it was using common sense. They all agreed.

  Here in the US, freedom of religion is more important than anything else it seems. There will be no governmental inquiry into how they handled these cases. I don't think there was one with the Catholic Church which is obviously much larger in size. The only way you can get the attention of religious institutions is to sue them. Which has happened already (Conti and others). I really believe the Aussies have helped lawyers in the US because the more things get exposed, the more ammunition US attorneys will have in attacking the process since that doesn't change from country to country.

  If nothing else, this is going to hurt recruiting. Hopefully, there will be some common sense policy changes coming out of this but I really doubt it.

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  TheWonderofYou 10 years ago

  Another case study idea:

  A victim 13 y girl calls the police and tells about what happend and says.

  "I am a 13 y and i am a JW. My daddy kisses me and touches me."

  The police asks: "are you a JW?" If the girl mentions the JW, the police sends instantly the "JW crisis intervention team" to the girl. So the police works together with the JW desaster team. This would be adquate help by the police.

  The ACCC the concentration camp for JW abusers is a therapy center together with a jail-like facility, if a locking away would be the right help at all. There are therapies especially for JW who have a special needs after becoming abusers. So they are not together with the worldly criminals but have a spiritual paradise within this camp. The costs for the institution are carried by the Body.

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