GB disassociates itself!!

by lulu 162 Replies latest watchtower scandals

  • jack2
    jack2

    Looking this thread over, including available documents as to what the WTS actually did, I personally can't help but conclude that signing on as an NGO does indeed constitute support for the UN. And yes, rank and file jws would be put before a judicial committee should they do something of the sort.

    One example that comes to mind is that when a person expresses interest in becoming a jw, they are asked to resign from membership in whatever church they may be on the membership rolls of. Why? In jw thinking, that listing of them as a member of a church constitutes support of that church. Thus, they are asked to resign.

    In my mind, the WTS's UN NGO member status made them a de facto UN supporter.

    Edited by - jack2 on 25 November 2002 23:2:17

  • Yadirf
    Yadirf

    Jack2,

    In my mind, the WTS's UN NGO member status made them a de facto UN supporter.

    I'm a living testimony to the fact that your line of reasoning is completely false. Although I didn't identify myself as being the "employee" in my example presented earlier, I was in fact the very employee being spoken about. Being a "member," I paid Union dues almost my entire career. However, that's where my "involvement" with the Union ended. For example, I never went to Union meetings, etc. No one could honestly accuse me of ever having been a Union "supporter". As a matter of fact not a few fellow employees demonstrated a dislike for me in various subtle ways because of my inactivity Union-wise. So, I'm here to tell you that you haven't the foggiest idea of what you're talking about with regards to what you said above. The "WTS's UN NGO member status" no more made them a UN supporter than my having been a Union member meant that I supported the Union. I know, because I've lived it ... and for over 30 years at that.

    .

  • Yadirf
    Yadirf

    Jack2,

    More of your faulty reasoning:

    One example that comes to mind is that when a person expresses interest in becoming a jw, they are asked to resign from membership in whatever church they may be on the membership rolls of. Why? In jw thinking, that listing of them as a member of a church constitutes support of that church. Thus, they are asked to resign.

    Why of course such ones are urged to withdraw their membership from their previous religion. That's because they ACTUALLY WERE OF THAT RELIGION, prior to their wish to become one of Jehovah's Witnesses, and before they become a JW they really ought to make a clean break from false religion. And so it's nothing whatsoever like the twist that you're putting on it.

    .

    Edited by - Yadirf on 26 November 2002 0:24:15

  • onacruse
    onacruse

    I must here simply state that I absolutely positively utterly ADORE the "ignore" button.

    I can see the Yadirf/Friday/etc has been posting a lot of her typical skubalon, and...

    I didn't have to read it, and...

    I won't see her reply to this post of mine!!!

    lulu, a good thread, and a good reminder of the blatant hypocrisy of the WTS.

    Craig

  • UnDisfellowshipped
    UnDisfellowshipped

    YADIRF,

    I'm just going to say a few comments.

    The JW's teach that ANY connection with the United Nations means you are ASSOCIATED with the Scarlet Beast.

    The JW's have condemned the Catholics for being NGO's.

    The JW's (at least in the past) have taught that JW's cannot even be a JANITOR for places like the United Nations.

    So, explain to me how the Watchtower is not guilty of ASSOCIATING with the Scarlet Beast.

    Edited by - UnDisfellowshipped on 26 November 2002 2:11:27

  • emancipated
    emancipated

    Great thread! I love to see someone try to support the WTS support of the UN. If a JW renounces his neutrality by voting in a political referendum then so does the GB by signing a doc that they support the ideals of the UN. That is unless God gave them authority to do so because he wanted all this scandal to break loose so his name could be dragged through the mud some more. To think that God approved of their actions is highly ludicrous unless he allowed it to happen so all could see the futility of putting your trust in earthling man or in nobles. That is exactly what jws are supposed to do, put their trust in the GB as Gods mouthpiece. Jesus said I am the way the truth and the life. He didn't say to his disciples; find the GB, listen to them and they will give you life.

    If he did I must have missed that scripture.

  • jack2
    jack2

    Yadirf, Membership in a labor union may not be a suitable analogy. Membership in a union is often required. A member of my household is a union member and pays dues. She does so because she was required to do so. Does she support the union? Does she get involved in it? Not necessarily - she, like you, has not attended union meetings either. But, her membership in that union is required - she had no choice. The employees voted to unionize.

    The WTS was certainly not required to become an NGO member of the UN. Their enlistment was completely voluntary, wasn't it? So why enlist as a member voluntarily and then say, in effect, 'well, we don't support it?'. Now, I do understand the rest of your union analogy - I do comprehend what you are trying to say. While I can see your point of view, I am not totally satisfied that what the WTS did in this case was what sould have been done by competent jw leadership. Also, as soon as the matter became known, they disassociated themselves from the UN. Why? Why not simply stay on and explain to all their rationale for joining the UN as an NGO?

    As for the church membership analogy I used, I do think it is valid. It is a voluntary membership. The person interested in becoming a jw is asked to resign. Why? Because being listed as member implies their support of the church.

    When my wife stated her interest in becoming a jw, she was asked to resign her membership from the church even though she had not attended for months, and had made no monetary donations. Why? Because despite her recent lack of involvment in that church, she was still considered a member, and therefore a supporter.

    Another analogy that can be made might be that of joining, say, the YMCA. Heck, my daughter was given a hard time by one jw because she she set foot inside the building once. Now, would not jws consider a membership at the YMCA as being supportive of the entity that is behind the YMCA, namely, the Catholic Church? If not, why do they generally refuse to join the YMCA?

    Also, Yadirf, I take strong exception to your use of terms like "twisted" and "faulty" with regard to my conclusions. When I offered comments, I merely offered them as my own personal conclusions. You are not obliged to share them. I merely stated my view after considering available facts. I did not attack your postion, did I? Did I even mention your name? Why do you, then, feel a need to use such strong negative terms? While you are not making an attack on me as a person, I still take exception to your use of such terminolgy rather than simply trying to reason things out.

    I have often found that many who post here, including, and sometimes especially, jw apologists, resort to such strong negative terminolgy when discussing matters. I am a jw myself, and I must say that some of the most unreasonable people, when it comes to trying to have a simple discussion, are active jws, who get extremely defensive at even the slightest suggestion that all may not be right with their religion. I have a family member who is like that - having a discussion with her is nearly impossible, as her demeanor quickly turns angry.

    To me, there is no need for that. A simple, reasoned discussion can be had by all without resorting to such terminolgy and its ugly implications. I'll get off my soapbox now.

  • Yadirf
    Yadirf

    emancipated,

    I love to see someone try to support the WTS support of the UN.

    Let's take a close look at this statement of yours, and see if it makes any sense at all. You accuse me of supporting the WTS's "support" of the UN, right? In other words, you presume that I actually agree that the WTS has indeed supported the UN. Obviously you can't read, emancipated. Are my posts/expressions really that far above your head?

    If a JW renounces his neutrality by voting in a political referendum then so does the GB by signing a doc that they support the ideals of the UN.

    No copy of a signed document has been produced that proves that the GB has done such a thing. I asked for such proof up above but have yet to see it. You merely make assumptions and speak of them as if they were facts.

    .

  • Yadirf
    Yadirf

    Jack2,

    I am a jw myself,

    You're either a liar, a hypocrite, or both!

    .

    Edited by - Yadirf on 26 November 2002 13:4:7

  • Yadirf
    Yadirf

    Jack2,

    Yadirf, Membership in a labor union may not be a suitable analogy. Membership in a union is often required.

    In my case it was NOT required. That's what makes it perfectly comparable to the WTS's membership as an NGO with the United Nations. Your entire argument is moot!

    .

    Edited by - Yadirf on 26 November 2002 13:12:2

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