Honesty: The argument in the OP is exactly trying to address the rational basis for forming ones view regarding Jesus and the bible in general. Asking if people think someone can change their mind is a distraction as their psychological predisposition is not really of importance. The issue is what the arguments in fact are and what is reasonable to believe.
Did Polonius kill his wife? A problem with apolegetics
by bohm 27 Replies latest jw friends
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Honesty
Honesty: The argument in the OP is exactly trying to address the rational basis for forming ones view regarding Jesus and the bible in general. Asking if people think someone can change their mind is a distraction as their psychological predisposition is not really of importance. The issue is what the arguments in fact are and what is reasonable to believe.
I understand that.
What is rational or logical about the "King of kings and Lord of lords" being conceived out of wedlock, being born in a barn, raised in a financially destitute home, going from town to town followed by a ragtag group of people who were looked down upon by the social elite as he preached a message of love, tolerance and change, imprisoned for his views and crucified alongside known criminals?
Any discussion regarding Jesus' resurrection necessitates a degree of faith and participants willing to admit that they don't have all the answers, otherwise the discussion will go nowhere fast.
A person who believes the resurrection is fact does not need all the facts to believe in the Resurrection, because the Holy Spirit intimately and powerfully reveals Jesus to them. -
bohm
A person who believes the resurrection is fact does not need all the facts to believe in the Resurrection, because the Holy Spirit intimately and powerfully reveals Jesus to them.
Since the holy spirit obviously choose not to reveal anything to me we can only agree to disagree. The intent of this topic is to examine the rational basis for believing in the stories in the bible and introducing the holy spirit is OT.
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Honesty
bohm
Since the holy spirit obviously choose not to reveal anything to me we can only agree to disagree. The intent of this topic is to examine the rational basis for believing in the stories in the bible and introducing the holy spirit is OT.I have no problem with agreeing to disagree with you or anyone else because each person is unique and has different views, opinions and beliefs than any other person who has ever lived.
BTW, in the New Testament, Jesus promised that He would send the Holy Spirit after He went away according to John 16:7-11.
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Caedes
In my opinion (yeah, I have one of those too. I'm sitting on it) each person has the privilege of believing it or not and no one will be able to change their minds no matter what 'evidence' or suppositions they provide.
I would very happily change my mind if I was provided with empirical evidence that I was wrong. In fact I would welcome people providing such evidence. If people choose not to change their mind after being presented with such evidence then they are fools. You are assuming that the default religious position of believing things despite evidence also applies to more rational individuals.
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Honesty
Caedes,
Do you have any solid evidence that Jesus was a real person who was resurrected?
Do you believe that Jesus was resurrected?
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Max Divergent
People once believed the earth was a circle hanging upon nothing.
They changed their minds when the evidence for it being a sphere held in place by gravity was no longer repressed by bible believers.
The bible still says now what it said then - a circle (circles are flat).
There's limited reason to think the bible is any more accurate that any other ancient writings.
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Caedes
Honesty,
There is no empirical evidence for either Jesus being real or being resurrected.
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Honesty
Caedes
I would very happily change my mind if I was provided with empirical evidence that I was wrong. In fact I would welcome people providing such evidence. If people choose not to change their mind after being presented with such evidence then they are fools. You are assuming that the default religious position of believing things despite evidence also applies to more rational individuals.Do you have any solid evidence that Jesus was a real person who was resurrected?
Do you believe that Jesus was resurrected?
Caedes
Honesty,
There is no empirical evidence for either Jesus being real or being resurrected.Any discussion regarding the reality of Jesus and His resurrection necessitates a degree of faith and participants willing to admit that they don't have all the answers, otherwise the discussion will go nowhere fast.
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Caedes
I admit I don't have all the answers but that doesn't mean I should accept things for which there is no evidence. If as you say this discussion requires a degree of faith then you have already conceded that your argument is not based on evidence.
The point I am making is that it would be close-minded and foolish to state that you would not be willing to accept that you are wrong if you are presented with empirical evidence that contradicts your beliefs. if you are not prepared to accept that you could be wrong then there isn't a discussion in the first place.