is this acceptable punishment for kids of JWS? (page 3)

Reborn2002

For those unaware, OldHippie makes a habit out of being a JW-apologist and sticking his foot in his mouth when he has no idea what he is talking about. In my own opinion, he is behaving as a troll and a$$hole. The only posts I have seen from him recently have been insulting and malicious towards children who have suffered. Does anyone deny this? Let us have a look at the evidence.

Have a look at this other terribly tragic case OldHippie decided he was qualified to discredit and poke fun at someone else's life experiences and sorrows:

http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.aspx?id=45015&site=3

Now when I was still a Jehovah's Witness attending Canterbury Congregation in Markham, Illinois.. I OFTEN saw children as little as 5 or younger slapped in the face during the middle of a meeting for making noise or moving around in the seat, or instead taken back to the ladies room and beaten so severely you could hear them screaming throughout the entire building. Did any of the JW's (including me at the time) show concern over this? No, because we had been taught in their doctrine that this was acceptable and even encouraged punishment to keep children in line.

UnDisfellowshipped provided excellent quotes to support this.

So OldHippie, you have no freaking idea what you are talking about. Are you going to discredit every individual who has experiences to relate when they live thousands of miles from one another and have never met? Are you going to debate the validity of the quotations taken from Watchtower literature which encourage physical beatings in the JW religion? I didn't think so dipshit.

When you grow a brain and get a clue about what you are talking about, then I suggest you post. Until then I highly suggest you keep your mouth shut and avoid clicking "Reply" on the JW.com board.

Mulan - your not defending OldHippie's comments this time? Perhaps now you see his antics are unacceptable.

Edited by - Reborn2002 on 28 January 2003 10:7:36

NameWithheld

Well, this is #1000, and a good one to use that for. I think that 'spanking' was a very common form of punishment for many years - only in the recent past has the human race in civilized parts of the world begun to question it as a whole. When I was in school, they still paddled kids. We had some horror stories about the wicked mean paddle the principle was supposed to have in his office(I never got to see it )

I know being raised a JW in the south, it was by far the common event to recieve a 'good spanking'. I know it was (and still is to some extent, though not as much anymore) highly recommended by the elders in every hall I ever attended. It was not an uncommon sight to see babies as young as 6 months getting 'smacks' for being 'loud' at meetings. "Train them from infancy" was the mantra. Of course nowdays I doubt they'd ever say anything bold enough to get them sued (like they used to). And I guess they never cared that making a young child sit still and quiet - and supposed to 'listen' to an adult program for two hours is really kind of perverse. (Well, it's supposed to be adult, but I don't think the JW programs pass for adult content anymore. Unless your IQ is 48.)

So I guess to sum up, I don't feel that JW beliefs were/are n ecessarily the main cause of over the top beatings to occur, I think that they enabled an abuser to get away with it, to justify it to himself/herself and others, and to cover it up. I certainly have never heard of a case where the elders steped in and a) tried to stop it, or b) reported it to athorities. I have however, personally seen many cases of elders abusing their own kids.

And on the case noted at the top of this thread, I would think this definitely borders on perverse. No man should ever do that to a kid regardless of age/sex, but moreso for preteen/teens.

pr_capone

I was beat on a regular basis until I was 16. And I was a good kid! 2 things happened. First, grew to be bigger than my mom and step-dad, and second, I told my mom one day that that was the last time she was ever gonna hit me. I looker right in the eye when I said it. She never touched me again.

As for the beatings at the KH. I have seen MANY kids get dragged to the back room and hit so hard that you could hear the slap up on stage. Not just one or 2 whacks either, try 7 or 8 times. Grown people hitting their small children as hard as they possibly can.

There is no excuse for that. I am not against spanking a kid when they act up but do not hit them as hard as you would an adult!

JeffT

OK, my experience is out of date (I haven't been in a kingdom hall since 1988), but I was in three different congregations, and in every one of them young kids were regularly taken to the back room and beaten for acting liking young kids. I knew of a number of mothers that would tuck a wooden spoon in their book bags to use on the kids. There was certainly a culture that accepted beating kids as normal.

I agree with the above comments that a man pulling a 10 and 12 year old girls clothing down is perverted.

AlanF

OldHippie, you live in Norway, right? I believe that in Norway it is illegal for parents to beat their children, and it is clear that Norwegian culture is very much against corporal punishment. In many other cultures, however, it is common and expected that children will be beaten. As a JW child in the 1950s and 1960s, I was beaten with a belt, a wooden paddle, a hair brush, heavy twigs, and my parents' hands. The last time my mother tried to beat me with a hair brush, it broke when she hit my ass. We both laughed and she beat me no more, but my father did (I won't try to say that I didn't sometimes deserve strong punishment). My wife and her brother and sisters were all beaten regularly with a belt. I remember hearing plenty of public talks encouraging parents to do this. So, your comments may apply in Norway, but not in other places. Don't judge JW culture in other countries by your own extremly narrow experience.

AlanF

phillipau

thanx for all the replies

the mother says that she wasnt there when they got these beltings. they have 2 sons which are his .but they dont get beltings . just the two girls . yes i think he is a perv as well or some kind of a nutter as he laughs when he hits these kids.the 12 yr old was living with me for ever as she had enough. she was here for 6 months before her mother demanded her to return home. so she returned home to keep the peace. i think that she went home cos she is scared of her mother .

i find this strange . during the xmas holidays just passed skye didnt go home to see her mother once till she got demanded her to go home

phill

SheilaM

WRONG WRONG WRONG My father was a belt man but EVEN he never pulled my siblings pants down. I was the youngest usually hiding from the tirade. ABUSE needs to be stopped we have a case here in KC where two girls have been sexually and physically abused for years by a boyfriend of the Mother and EVERYONE KNEW but did nothing DFS<state side> KNEW BUT DID NOTHING.

I am too the breaking point we have had BABIES being killed by sexual and physical abuse EVERY DANG week and everyone just goes about as if nothing happened. I am a friggin pacifist and I am starting to think maybe if they blew some of these pervs crap away at the courthouse maybe the next perv would think twice ERRRRRRRRRR I am sick of kids being hurt sorry for the rant

PS I also have minimal hearing in my right ear do to a hardy slap as a child!!

scotsman

It is not an acceptable form of punishment for any children, JWs or not. I was never beaten and only rarely spanked as a child and there was only one family that beat their kids in our KH and this reflected their non-Witness background far more than any Bible 'education' they had recieved on becoming JWs.

Linking severe corporal punishment with JWs is a nonsense, it's far more likely to have socio-economic causes and should be reported to the authorities.

My tuppence.

kaypax24

JUST ANOTHER PROBLEM THIS SO CALLED GODLY ORGANISATION HAS

1) CHILD ABUSE

2)PHYSICAL ABUSE

3)MENTAL ABUSE

4)MONEY LAWNDERING

5)FALSE PROPHECY

EVERYTHING THEY CLAIM NOT TO BE

Tatiana

Although it is not acceptible by any decent parents standards, but it IS NORMAL by JW standards. I was raised in that cult, and got out when I was old enough to leave home. I seen children get thrashed by hickory swithces, thorn bushes, shoes, belts, I myself was beaten with a boat paddle while on a camping trip with other JW famileys. My crime? I wanted to play on a sunny Saturday afternoon instead of study the Wachtower! Go to any of the Kingdom Halls and you will here the cries of innocent children as they are "disiplined"

kc

Totally agree--KC

Scotsman...I don't know what KH you went to. Did they only have three families?????

I was raised in the south. It was very common for all my friends at the KH to get regular beatings. I know my sister and I were not the only ones. I remember some days not being able to go to school because of the whelps on my legs. We weren't allowed to wear pants when I was in grade school.

And unfortunately, my step-dad believed in beatings on bare behinds. He always made us pull our pants down before getting the belt. My mom liked to hit indiscriminitly, with whatever she had in her hand at the time. The only time anything was done in my cong., was when Brother Phifer lost his temper at an assembly and slammed his son, Jimmy, (my best friend) on the concrete by the pool. He was a ministerial servant and got reprimanded. Only because you could see the wounds on Jimmy's face.

The witnesses may be different today, but not so with my mom. She visited my niece last year in SC. (on a trip home from Ecuador) and they got into a huge fight because my mom beat my niece's 11 month old baby for touching the VCR.

sad.....

Edited by - Tatiana on 3 February 2003 18:22:3

is this acceptable punishment for kids of JWS?

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