Who Really Rules the World???

by ARoarer 16 Replies latest watchtower bible

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  Sangdigger

  Kenneson, I think you hit the nail on the head. I totaly agree with you. A God who creates the universe and a world in it would certainly rule over it. I would hate to think of what it would be like if he didnt.(compare Dan.4:17, 25, 32,) Jesus even told Pontius Pilate that he (Pilate) would have no power at all againts him unless it had been given him from above. John said in John 3:27 "A man can receive nothing unless it has been given to him from heaven. Rom. 13:1 "For there is no authority exept from God, and the authorities that exist are appointed by God."

  I think Paduan was also right when he/she stated the word "World" is mis-used by the dubs. They would have you believe that Satan has complete control over the "Global World", and someday God will step in and take it from him. But i think scripture is plain that Satan only rules over the "Ungodly" and does with them as he wills.( 2Tim 2:26 ) The only scripture that would give this a problem would be where Satan showed Jesus the Kingdoms of the world and offered them to him, and said if he would bow down to him, they would be his, because they(the kingdoms) had been given to him. Perhaps Almighty God gives him limited control (although God is still sovereign), or Satan was Lying to Jesus, to appeal to his human side? I'm not sure. If anybody has any comments on this one, please elaborate. I've read different commentaries on this passage in the past, but wasnt really satisfied with any of the answers offered.

  On the scripture at 2 Cor. 4:4, i think it refers to Satan, although God is said to have blinded the eyes of the unbelievers in several other places.(Isa. 6:10, Rom. 11:7,8 Ex.4:21) But maybe he does this by simply allowing Satan to sway them as he will? The reason i think this particular verse refers to the devil, is it says "...the god of this age..." This age would seem to represent the current world mind-set expressed by the ideals, opinions, goals hopes and veiws of the majority of people. Something not godly, but essentially worldly.
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  ARoarer

  All such great insights. Kenneson I agree with you. And also Paduan. The tract with the picture of Jesus being offered all the kingdoms of the earth by Satan is misleading by the Watchtower teaching that these Kingdoms were Satan's to give to Jesus if he did an act of worship. That scripture, to me, proves the opposite. Jesus, if you think about it told Satan to go away. Jesus, being the one who was sent to this world by his Heavenly Father, to bring peace to all mankind and an indefinitely lasting rulership, this prince of peace knew full well Satan could not have the authority to give these kingdoms to Jesus. They were already given to him by his Father. Jesus himself was there in creating them in the beginning. Evil does not prevail when there is goodness representing the Creator. When I think about that tract with that hand gripped around the globe I think of the Watchtower's tight grip on the members. It is they who are actually mimicing Satan by saying in effect that if you do an act of worship to me you will have all the kingdoms of the earth, and live forever on it, and you will positively not die. Watchtower is speaking Satan's words to the R&F, the way Satan spoke to Eve, and tried to speak to Jesus. I think about this often lately and it seems to make more sense to me.
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  Beans
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  Sangdigger

  Aroarer, I appreciate your points on the paralell between what satan offers, and what the WTS offers. I never really thought about it that way. I also like your point about Jesus being the very creator of the things satan offered him. The king doesnt give up his throne, only to worship another to gain it back. However, i still find it confusing that satan would make the remark, "all these things have been given to me" we know that Jesus knew everything, even in his human state. So if satan was just lying, what was the point? To tempt his humanity?
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  peacefulpete

  Fellas..It was recently pointed out that tha literary parallels between that of Buddah and Krishna with jesus are so many that if the authors of the older stories was alive he could have sued for plagerism. Buddah as tempted by the evil spirit after fasting for 47 days when about 30 years old and was offered world power. He declined and was blessed by the spirit world. The Hindu Zarathustra was likewise tempted in the wilderness. Give it up. This is literature. It teaches a moral, but not history.
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  peacefulpete

  I know this is a long dead thread but perhaps it will appeal enough to some to be rereading them. I have found additional support for the conclusion that 2 Cor 4:4 is refferring to Yhwh rather than Satan. Elaine Pagels book ,The Gnostic Gospels relates that the Gnostic form of Christianity addressed YHWH as the God of this Age, or Archon a usurper of power and not the ultimate god. They held that He was the source of the religios ignorance and physical unrest in the world. There are many reasons to conclude "Paul's" letter is in fact written from a Gnostic or as least a preGnostic viewpoint. Language, phrasology, and cryptic double meanings as found in his letters are standard Gnostic material.
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  Francois

  Well first the Bible does say that the Devil rules the world so your quite reasonable objection is to the Bible not the JWs.

  Not so. The bible says that the "Most High rules in the kingdoms of men"

  francois