Did Jeruselm fall in 587 or 586 BCE? (page 3)

notsurewheretogo

The bigger point is...it is NOT 607 BCE according to facts.

Alan F's article is simply a summary of 4 differing methodologies in trying to resolve the still remaining dilemma of the 586/7 debate and that remains the problem of METHODOLOGY. The celebrated WT scholars have adopted a very different methodology in not being hamstrung by differing and competing calendrical systems used at that time. Our methodology fully accounts for the 70 years of Jeremiah which allows the fixing of positive dates for positive events making it easy to ascribe biblical events to a modern scheme of Bible Chronology.

scholar JW emeritus

Finkelstein

Our methodology fully accounts for the 70 years of Jeremiah

and that's all the WTS does account for all the other pertaining information from archaeological findings and the bible itself.

The WTS didn't take into account when Nebuchadnezzar took to the throne of Babylon or when the first extraction of slaves occurred or what happened in the following years leading up to the final destruction of Jerusalem.

So we can Scholar bullshiter is corrupt and is intellectually dishonest as his cohorts running the Watchtower Corporation..

Lets make it perfectly clear, the WTS made Jerusalem's destruction on 607 because it wanted to make 1914 work, even pushing the return of the Israelites to Jerusalem 1 year from their original release date from Babylon. (538)

Daniel's prophecy was wrong in the number of years of desolation.

Finkelstein

Actual date setting by so called faithful followers and preachers of Jesus's return and new kingdom order, is an act of disloyal apostasy according to Jesus's own words and proclamation, so how does scholar JW emeritus take a view upon that ?

and as a side question, does scholar JW emeritus have some money involved with the WTS/JWorg. ???

Doug Mason

Hi Scholar,

Prove 539 BCE without relying on secular scholars' absolute dates and chronology.

Doug

notsurewheretogo

Scholar...care to explain why the WT said it was 606 BCE only to change it to 607 BCE after they found out there was no zero year between 1 BCE and 1CE?

How could they change the date set in stone in history if it were based on facts? If it were 606 BCE and they realized there was no zero year then they should have changed the date of the end of the prophecy to 1915 CE yet they changed something set in history to ensure 1914 CE.

Dishonest, you can't change a date in history to your preference unless you are a cult.

joey jojo

The prophecy of Jeremiah in chapter 25 doesn't mention the destruction of the temple in relation to determining the 70 year period.

25 The word that came to Jeremiah concerning all the people of Judah in the fourth year of Je·hoiʹa·kim+ son of Jo·siʹah, the king of Judah, which was the first year of King Neb·u·chad·nezʹzar*of Babylon. 2 This is what Jeremiah the prophet spoke concerning*all the people of Judah and all the inhabitants of Jerusalem:

8 “Therefore this is what Jehovah of armies says, ‘“Because you would not obey my words, 9 I am sending for all the families of the north,”+ declares Jehovah, “sending for King Neb·u·chad·nezʹzar*of Babylon, my servant,+ and I will bring them against this land+ and against its inhabitants and against all these surrounding nations.+ I will devote them to destruction and make them an object of horror and something to whistle at and a perpetual ruin. 10 I will put an end to the sound of exultation and the sound of rejoicing from them,+ the voice of the bridegroom and the voice of the bride,+ the sound of the hand mill and the light of the lamp. 11 And all this land will be reduced to ruins and will become an object of horror, and these nations will have to serve the king of Babylon for 70 years.”’+

12 “‘But when 70 years have been fulfilled,+ I will call to account*the king of Babylon and that nation for their error,’+ declares Jehovah, ‘and I will make the land of the Chal·deʹans a desolate wasteland for all time.

These verses clearly show that the prophecy wasnt specific to the Jews but all the nations around the area were to be subject to Babylon for 70 years.

It doesn't mention the temple.

It doesn't say the land will be in desolation for 70 years, it says that the nations will be in servitude to Babylon for 70 years.

Lastly, the 70 years were going to end, not with the return of the Jews to their homeland but with the punishment of the King of Babylon, which everyone agrees happened in 539 bce.

If the 70 years of servitude started when Jeremiah spoke the prophecy, that gives us a start date of 605, being the first year of Nebuchadnezzar. Is it possible that the 70 years had already started by then, as Babylon was already ruling anyway?

If the 70 years started at or about the time of Jeremiahs prophecy, that opens another can of worms for the WTS. Jeremiah 1 says that the first year of Nebuchadnezzar was the 4th year of Jehoiakim. According to jw.org, the 4th year of Jehoiakim was 624 bce.

scholar

Finkelstein

WT Chronology embraces all of the facts, biblical, historical, secular and textual evidence for nothing is omitted or ignored. The facts pertaining to the reign of Nebuchadnezzar are well attested in the Bible and these form the basis of our wondrous Bible Chronology and this is well verified by the fulfilment prophecy culminating to the year 1914 CE

scholar JW emeritus

scholar

Hi Doug

The establishment of 539 BCE as the date for the Fall of Babylon and as Pivotal date for the dating of the OT is based on known secular sources and the Biblical record so that means that such a date cannot be constructed independently of known and recognized sources as documented in WT publications. However, in keeping with the thesis of Rodger Young's article it is all about METHODOLOGY and that is why our Chronology is different to other scholars.

scholar JW emeritus

scholar

notsurewheretogo

In order to answer your question you should consult with WT publications which have nicely addressed your question for that is the place to go!!!!

Chronology is not a static subject and like all other areas of knowledge is subject to change so WT scholars have seen reason to make an adjustment for that is what scholarship does for it moves forward.

scholar JW emeritus

Did Jeruselm fall in 587 or 586 BCE?

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