Do You Think Trump Bares Any Responsibility For The Mass Shootings Occuring?

by minimus 236 Replies latest jw friends

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  LoveUniHateExams

  I get into a major fight about some company policy or procedure. One of the women even calls me a mf-er in front of everyone at work - that's not the correct analogy.

  The correct analogy would be: you and these 4 women get into a major war of words, one of the 4 women, a new recruit, says she's gonna have your ass fired or arrested and calls you MF.

  Then you say, hey why don't these four go back where they came from and fix stuff, etc.

  Trump's a brash, ugly-talking New Yorker who has no filter whatsoever. But that doesn't mean he's racist.

  As an aside, there's a nice guy in the UK called Karl Pilkington. He and Ricky Gervais have a radio talk show. Karl has no filter and no idea about sensitivity. He was talking about Rosa Parks and said why didn't she want to sit at the back of the bus - she's lazy (XD). He had no idea that his words are offensive. He didn't see Rosa Parks as a person of colour, he just saw her as a person. He doesn't really think how his words calling her lazy have anything to do with a negative stereotype or unacceptable generalisation of black people as being lazy.

  I think Trump is more aware than Karl Pilkington but he's in a war of words with political opponents. He was just saying some ugly stuff in response. Does Trump usually go up to people of colour and tell them to go home?

  I don't think so.
  
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  breakfast of champions

  The correct analogy would be: you and these 4 women get into a major war of words, one of the 4 women, a new recruit, says she's gonna have your ass fired or arrested and calls you MF.
  Then you say, hey why don't these four go back where they came from and fix stuff, etc.

  I would absolutely still be suspended or fired for saying that.

  I also think that if I were to say that to the four workmates -- even people I don't like and who don't like me -- there's no doubt that it would be coming from a racially motivated place.

  That's why I would't ever say anything like that.
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  LoveUniHateExams

  I also think that if I were to say that to the four workmates -- even people I don't like and who don't like me -- there's no doubt that it would be coming from a racially motivated place.

  That's why I would't ever say anything like that - a lot of people wouldn't say that because they have a filter, they realise that certain things are sensitive or could be taken in a certain way.

  Telling people to go back to where they came is definitely said by actual racist people, but the sentence 'why don't you go back to where you came from ...' is ambiguous.

  If Trump had been having a war of words with John Oliver and he told him the same, I don't think there'd be this much fuss and accusations of racism.

  Again, the evidence that supports Trump's supposed racism is ambiguous at best.
  
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  RubaDub

  Let's take an unbiased (If that is possible) poll on what would happen in a workplace based on the above scenarios:

  1). The workers (4 women of color) call the boss a MF for being a racist.

  2). The boss gets angry and tells the 4 women to go back where they came from.

  Everyone in the office hears this.

  What would likely occur at YOUR office?

  Rub a Dub
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  breakfast of champions

  Telling people to go back to where they came is definitely said by actual racist people, but the sentence 'why don't you go back to where you came from ...' is ambiguous.

  Well, hell. . . ALL sentences are ambiguous!

  The only way you can kind of disambiguate a sentence is by context. Even then, there is always some sort of ambiguity present in language. It's not a freaking code.

  If I go out into the yard and tell my grandkids "Hey, why don't you all go eat some watermelon" and they go and eat some watermelon, that is certainly not racist.

  If I were to use that sentence in other contexts, well. . . . .

  SO yeah, it's a fact that sentences are ambiguous and we use context to disambiguate.

  I am saying that in context, TO ME, not the media, not the democrats/liberals whatever, Trump's statement comes off as racially charged and motivated.
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  LoveUniHateExams

  @Rubadub - your poll doesn't necessarily suggest that the boss' behaviour is racist, instead it may suggest that political correctness has permeated most aspects of our lives, including the working environment.

  We need to go back to the Oxford dictionary definition of racism.

  1 Prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism directed against someone of a different race based on the belief that one's own race is superior.

  1.1 The belief that all members of each race possess characteristics, abilities, or qualities specific to that race, especially so as to distinguish it as inferior or superior to another race or races.

  ^^^ Using the definition as a guide, is Trump racist? Was what he said racist?

  https://www.lexico.com/en/definition/racism
  
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  RubaDub

  @Rubadub - your poll doesn't necessarily suggest that the boss' behaviour is racist, instead it may suggest that political correctness has permeated most aspects of our lives, including the working environment.

  U N H E ...

  There was no mention in my poll about the boss being a racist. I was just polling based on the facts as presented.

  Rub a Dub
  
  
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  LoveUniHateExams

  Well, hell. . . ALL sentences are ambiguous! - not really, no.

  If Trump had been caught saying 'I think white people are superior to black people', that would be an unambiguously racist statement. If Trump is or was a member of the KKK, then that would be unambiguous, too.

  The evidence that supposedly shows Trump is a racist wouldn't stand up in a court of law.

  He's been accused of being a sexual predator on the basis that he was caught saying 'some women will let rich guys get away with anything, grab their pussy, anything.' While what he said was obviously stupid, there needs to be actual evidence of him being a sexual predator if he really is one. Same applies to charges of racism.
  
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  LoveUniHateExams

  Rubadub - your own words ...

  1). The workers (4 women of color) call the boss a MF for being a racist. (italics mine)
  
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  blondie

  All the parties involved would be interviewed privately by Human Resources (HR) including the "boss" and 4 workers directly involved, as well as any workers who heard and/or saw this happen.

  The other workers would be asked what they saw and heard, and their own feelings about such comments or have they experienced things that might be racist and what.

  Then HR will determine if more info is needed, such as if previous situations have occurred between this boss and other employees. If HR determines that the source is mainly the boss because HR sees a pattern (may have already tried to resolve before with similar situations involving other employees), they may talk to him/her privately to put him/her on notice and review again with him/her what the work rules and how they specifically apply in this situation).

  HR would also review with each individual privately what the work rules are and how they apply and also provide training in general for all people in that work area.

  Then HR schedules group training by an outside source for all directly involved and the rest of staff. In some cases, scenarios will be re-enacted by outside source staff and then allow the people attending the training to offer suggestions and/or ask questions on how to resolve without referring to any specific event.

  Then everyone will be encouraged to do their part in making this process of handling issues a success and that HR will be checking back with individuals to see how it is going.

  Regardless of "fault", the yelling, swearing, and inappropriate comments by all will be addressed by HR.

  Unfortunately, in the situation regarding President Trump and the 4 congresswomen, no one to date seems to have a way to use someone or some group to mediate this problem. And some that could, are reluctant to step up for various reasons.