In many UK circuits the CO stays in a flat which is owned by a JW. Usually they are entitled to housing benefit , so effectively the taxpayer pays for the rent. Most COs used to say that they didn't like Kingdom Hall flats because they sometimes got hassle from vandals or kids hanging around etc , to retain charitable status they were registered as "caretakers" so were expected to do occasional maintenance such as painting or cutting the grass and also it was very handy for elders and JWs from the congregations that used the hall to "drop in" with their problems etc. They generally much preferred the anonymity of a flat which hardly anyone knew the address of.
Wythenshawe Kingdom Hall - Sold
by AdamCzarnobay 31 Replies latest jw friends
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blondie
Thanks, dozy. I see how they get around the "tax" issue.
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careful
Blondie, I have long appreciated your well-researched and informative posts here. That said, I have a problem with this statement:
But a jw can't donate money to another religious organization or accept money in pay for work done from a religious organization.
There are bros/sisters who work or have worked for colleges and universities run by Catholic and Protestant religions. I knew a sister who worked at a Protestant one as a postal clerk. I asked her whether her paycheck was from the postal service or the college. She said the latter. She was in good standing in the cong. and loved the FS.
Right now and for years, there is a brother named Edgar Foster in good standing who teaches part-time at Lutheran Lenoir-Rhyne University in North Carolina. He got a PhD from the University of Glasgow and has a blog defending the org and its beliefs:
https://fosterheologicalreflections.blogspot.com
Here is a description of a course he teaches from the university's online catalogue:
And another of a teaching award he received in 2016:
So it appears either that things have changed or there was some long-standing "exception" in this regard. I knew that sister many years ago.
What do you think?
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blondie
careful, could have changed, I haven't checked deeply to see if it has changed since I left. Colleges might be different. But working directly for a church or church organizational structure, probably is not allowed. Such as repairing or maintenance on a church steeple. But if a jw works for or through a contractor as the employer, it might be allowed then. But I have learned over the years, that outside the organization perception some times overrules the details. I wonder where the money comes to pay their salary, indirectly or directly from the church involved. Also, some times here church private schools will not employ people not members of their religion. That has been contested here in the US since it seems that religion should not be a factor in employment. I will check and appreciate your comments. I worked for a law enforcement agency but did not have to carry a gun as a requirement of my employment. That was quibbled about by some jws, but then the WTS had an article that said the issue was having to carry a gun as a requirement of employment. It is so legalistic, the WTS is a bunch of Pharisees.
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blondie
Everything I have found shows that the WTS does it on a case by case basis, and then seems to leave it up to the jw in question (we know how that goes). One article is from WT 4/15/1999 p.28 -30 Questions from Readers. If not triggering can go to the Watchtower Online Library. Below the WTS also talks about how each case might be viewed by those outside the WTS too. Perception, perception, perception, the trick the WTS uses often to guilt jws into not doing something that has no real scriptural basis. So it is not a blanket belief officially but it can up being that way unofficially.
I found this in a October 2019 WT page 12-13: A true Christian must make sure that his secular employment has nothing to do with Babylon the Great. For example, he would not be an employee of a church. Furthermore, a Christian who is employed by some other business would not want to do extensive work at a facility that promotes false worship. And if he owns a business, he would certainly not bid on a job or do contract work for any part of Babylon the Great. Why do we take such a firm stand? Because we do not want to share in the works and sins of religious organizations that are unclean in God’s eyes...Years ago, a self-employed elder was asked by a contractor to accept a small carpentry job at a church in the town where the brother lived. The contractor knew that the brother had always said he would not work on churches. But this time the contractor was desperate to find someone for the job. Even so, the brother stuck to Bible principles and declined the work. The next week, the local newspaper showed a photograph of another carpenter attaching a cross to the church. If our brother had compromised his stand, it could have been his picture in the paper. Think of how damaging that would have been to his reputation among his fellow Christians! Think, too, of how Jehovah would have felt.
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careful
Thanks for the further work, blondie. I wonder how being a professor of religion at a Lutheran university works into that scenario. I also wonder if the so-revered GB is even aware of such a thing, or if they are aware of it, whether they simply don't want to touch it. They might lose an appointed man (assuming Foster is such), something in short supply these days.
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dozy
Ray Franz's book "In Search of Christian Freedom" relates a story (P352) about a JW called David Hayes who had a home security fire alarm business which amongst its many customers included some churches who was disfellowshipped despite making huge efforts to try to pacify the elders concerned , such as not installing any new alarms in churches and getting another employee to do any servicing on them. In my home congregation a JW who did window cleaning was spotted cleaning the windows of a flat owned by the Mormon church which was used by their missionaries and was called into the KH "back room" and despite reasoning that he had a contract to clean all 8 flats in the complex was told not to clean it otherwise he would be removed as a MS.
As ever in the Org things are complex and often contradictory. How "Lutheran" really is the university? It might be that its something of a historical name without a direct connection nowadays and / or that the seniority of the JW (perhaps he helps the Society write articles , for example) means he gets something of a free pass. A lot depends on the local elders.
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raymond frantz
Unbelievable!!! That was my old kingdom hall from 2001-2003 and right next to the Northerden Circuit Assembly Hall. This is not the only ex Christian Church to be converted to a mosque in the area , same thing happened in the nearby Heald Green , I think a Methodist Church was turned to a mosque too. Nothing surprises me, uncontrolled immigration the past 20 years have turned Britain to a communist caliphate!
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Beth Sarim
In Search of Christian Freedom..
Great book to follow CoC.
Whos to know if it will be re-released again.
There were some gems in that book. ISOCF.
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stan livedeath
Nothing surprises me, uncontrolled immigration the past 20 years have turned Britain to a communist caliphate!
its a nightmare
the most popular boys name in Britain is Mohammed.