Just keep asking her who she helped today and in what capacity did she make their life better, try and reason could there be a non religious course for the day that would of helped her fellow man more.
JW Wife not listening
by rathernotsay 49 Replies latest jw friends
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TD
QFT
....you either need to get marriage counseling or it's time to part ways...
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rathernotsay
I've tried playing the headship card a number of times. I know she wants me to make the decisions for our household yet when I do whatever rule etc I've put in place gets listened to for a week or so then we're back to the way things were. A prime example of this would be the 3 year old sleeping in our bed. I haìd said to her that enough is enough and that if he's in our bed I'm going to move him and if he wakes up its on her to go lie down with him in his bed instead of just letting him in ours. I even went as far as saying if I purchase a brand new bed for us that not once he was to sleep in it. Thousands of dollars and a new bed later and he's still I our bed. This may not seem like a big deal to some but it's just another thing I'm not bwing listened to about
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tepidpoultry
There's "loyalty to Jehovah" and "Jehovah first" talk going on constantly in person and the publications,
This is regularly applied to as "THE RELIGION first" over everything and everybody (including self)
This is applied and rationalized differently by every jw,
Her deceipt re pioneering sounds like she's rationalizing "loyalty to Jehovah over loyalty to hubby,"
If you tried to curtail her Witness activity enough, they have a rule on the books that she can leave you on the grounds of "absolute spiritual endangerment" (Everyone applies this differently),
I'm not trying to scare you but just give you a heads up, it's a weird wonderland in there,
All the best,
Write as often as you like,
We like to help out where we can,
:0)
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Anony Mous
You have two issues it seems, you have your regular marital issues and you have someone that believes you will die very soon and seems to hide her problems into the cult.
Someone said something about her cheating on you, evidently the elders don't know about this (you have to have at least a 2 year clear record for pioneering), perhaps you could just go talk to them, noncombative, ask them you want to know more about them his pioneering thing your wife is doing. Just let them do their spiel, play along nicely and then near the end of the conversation just bring up you're worried about her spending time outside your time so much because you have marital issues, they WILL want to know more and then just casually bring out the issues you've been facing and your worries about potentially using that time as an excuse for meeting her lover.
I know it can be hard but you have to treat the JW side of her as a combative ex while doubling down on the 'normal' stuff if you want to keep the relationship going. Once she is disfellowshipped, love bomb her subtly so she sees the contrast.
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Scully
I've just read through some of your previous posts, and I'm truly sorry to learn about the rough patches you've been through.
It seems to me that your wife is trying very hard to (a) redeem herself for her previous lapses in judgement and (b) distinguish herself among her JW peers as someone who embraces The Truth™ completely to the point where other priorities take a back seat (you, your marriage, your children, working toward financial stability with you, your children's education, and so on). Understand that (b) is considered highly virtuous among JWs. It is also a sign (to me, at least) that she feels some unworthiness in herself among her JW peers - it's not uncommon for a person who has strayed from their marriage to Show Works Befitting Repentance™ (such as Pioneering™) to demonstrate that they've changed from their previous lapse in judgement.
As a teenager, I did some things during a Rebellious Phase™ that JWs weren't supposed to do, but once I started being ostracized by JWs (both at the KH and socially, including my mother), it triggered a high energy zeal for The Truth™ - wanting to go to all the Meetings™, isolating myself from Worldly™ peers, and wanting to get Baptized™ and Pioneer™. In retrospect, I can see the manipulation for what it was, and I was grateful that my application to Pioneer™ was rejected by the Elders™ at the time.
Given your circumstances, you could ring up an Elder™ and say that while you support her going to Meetings™ and in the Door-to-Door Ministry™, you need to draw the line on Pioneering™, as your children need her, and if she has that much spare time on her hands, you would appreciate it if she had a part-time job to help with the finances of the home. That's not to say you wouldn't reconsider once your youngest child is in school full days, but for now, you're asserting your Headship™ and asking her to prioritize the children's needs and the family's needs over Full-Time Service™. Tell her that you need to sit down with her and Count The Cost™ of Pioneering™ (none of this Jehovah Will Provide™ nonsense!!) - will she need her own vehicle? How will she pay for one? Surely she shouldn't expect you to take on the cost! Will she pay for the insurance and fuel and repairs? What about the child care arrangements - you have one that isn't yet old enough for school, so is she planning to take the baby with her or find child care for her? (Newsflash: JWs don't really like it when Sisters™ take their children along in Service™ - I tried more than a few times to do so, but I was basically shunned and not included in any car group - even when I offered to use our vehicle.) How do you feel about the children going Door-to-Door™ with her during the off-school times (weekends, school holidays, etc.)? Surely your feelings count for something!
If you deal with the Elders™ with this kind of approach, there's no way they would give her permission to Pioneer™. You have every right to assert yourself in this situation. Be careful not to overdo it, though, because the Elders™ could tell her that you are bad for her Spirituality™ or be the cause of Absolute Spiritual Endangerment™, which would give her the green light to leave you and take the children too. (Note that there is no Biblical basis for this belief.)
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steve2
From reading your earlier threads and your comments in this one, I'm getting the impression you are the more vulnerable spouse in this marriage. It's not like you simply give in - you don't. But there's a sense that ultimately - directly or indirectly - she calls the shots and you are left to deal with it.
An example is the kid sleeping in the marital bed despite your protests. What's that about? Even JWs would consider it unwise and inappropriate to have him sleep with you two. It's not even anything to do with her beliefs!
I'm taken by the fact that this is one of several issues over which you are simply ineffectual. It is as if your views and values dont matter to her - and you go along with it and cope by complaining about her but little else actually changes.
You could do worse than see a registered psychologist or therapist to acquire some knowledge and skills on behaving in a more assertive and effective manner within the marriage.
I wouldn't wait for her to join you in seeking help from a professional - because ultimately it is you who is being treated like the door mat in your marriage.
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rathernotsay
Thanks everyone, ive found this to be one of the most helpful online communities around, mature, respectful and truthful answers.
I don't think seperating is on the cards. But perhaps id be silly to rule it out. We've dealt with past problems. The issue is this time it's just reoccurring problems.
Things I've told her over and over not to do. Another example just so you get my angle.. I have a 'mancave'... just an office kinda thing off the side of my garage. A place that I like to keep my things like my collectables, got a pc, tv/ps4 out there too. It's understood that this is dad's room, ive tried to tell her that she's not to touch anything in there, and it's my responsibility to keep it clean. Yet time after time she comes in and 'cleans'. Why does this annoy me? Mostly cause she throws things away, what she thought was rubbish may be a reciept I needed to keep, or something I was fixing. I half think this is just a reason for going through my stuff.
Sorry for the spelling mistakes too, I'm at work trying to do too many things and not proof reading lol
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Pete Zahut
1st Peter 3 :1 In the same way, you wives, be in subjection to your husbands,+ so that if any are not obedient to the word, they may be won without a word through the conduct of their wives,+ 2 because of having been eyewitnesses of your chaste conduct+ together with deep respect.
I'm not big on the whole JW "headship" thing but as a Jehovah's Witness she is going from door to door claiming to believe that the bible is the word of god and is claiming to follow his laws and is recommending her way of life to others.
How can she make that claim if she is disregarding what the bible says and what her religion is continually admonishing women to do? What would the householder say if they knew that the woman standing at their doorstep had 3 small children and had a husband who for good reason, specifically asked her not to spend so much time in this activity until the children were older? What would they think of a woman who thinks she has her life together enough so as to be able to preach to others, yet continually disrespects her husbands wishes as he tries to lead his family down the road of life?
I would sit her down and read the scripture above to her from her own Bible and ask her the questions I've posed above and tell her once more what your wishes are.
I have a feeling she may need a reason to get out of the house and to be around other people and Pioneering is a way to do that and get accolades from her JW peers at the same time. You don't want to make her feel trapped and enslaved by her marriage to you and her duties to the children but someone has to take care of them when they are this small. I can't see how she could pioneer and be driving around in a car all day with small children, nor do I think it would be good to leave them in the care of someone else and have them do her job, just so she can get out of the house.
Find out if being bored or stuck at home is at the root of this problem. Maybe you could arrange things so that one day a week she is freed up do whatever she wants, whether it's going in the door to door work or going out to lunch with a friend.
Let her know that this isn't a power play on your part or about you wanting your way or wanting to boss her around. It's more about the two of you wanting to come to an agreement about how to manage your family and about her following through with what you've both agreed on.
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sparrowdown
JWs do not listen this makes it very hard to reason with them. Their religious devotion is a like form of narcissim and they are trained to choose their religion over everything else. The indoctrination they receive each and every week leaves them unbalanced in their decision making and words like rational and logical are simply not part of their vocabulary. Nor is consideration for anyone else's personal wishes or respect for decisions not consistent with their JW worldview and mindset. All this, in their mind, is perfectly justified and if you bring it to their attention you are the demanding one.
Sucks I know but there you have it.
I agree with Steve you're being too nice. Continue to state what your wishes are clearly and consistently and maybe it's time to tell her you have respected her religion and her beliefs but now it's time for that arrangement to be reciprocal and she needs to respect your wishes and your beliefs also.
Good luck.