not to worry about a wt's armageddon, babylon tG has to be attacked finished first, billions of Muslims "christians" , Buddhists, Hindus. The anointed raptured, ruptured.
Ukraine - Nato - US crisis
by mikeflood 65 Replies latest social current
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smiddy3
The USA wasn`t going to tolerate a potential armed threat from a foreign power on their doorstep ,the Cuban missile crises.
And Russia doesn`t want the same thing happening on their doorstep.
Isn`t it all happening because Ukraine was about to join NATO ?
Or is that just too simplistic a reason.
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Diogenesister
Should I move to New Zealand?
Worried,
Chipping Norton.
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TonusOH
Ukraine joining NATO would have left Russia pretty vulnerable because of the terrain. I think Putin has wanted to annex it completely for a long time in order to avoid being in a very weak military position. If anything shows how vital that region is, it's the extent to which NATO has helped Ukraine, once they realized that the Russian army was in rough shape and could be substantially weakened, if not outright defeated.
As for how long it goes, I think it will last a couple of years. Putin cannot lose this war or it is the end of him. Zelensky is in a similar spot, since he has made it clear that he will not negotiate any terms that do not include Russia returning any land they are holding. NATO would be in a pretty nasty spot if Russia takes enough territory or wins outright. I don't see a negotiated settlement until there is no more will to fight, which will likely only happen once one or both armies are ground into dust.
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Rivergang
Hi Smiddy,
I don't think that the current situation in the Ukraine can be compared to the Cuban Missile Crisis of 60 years ago.
The issue then was not about a communist country on America's doorstep; rather it was about the installation of Soviet intermediate range nuclear missiles on that island. By contrast, an agreement was reached in the late 1980s (negotiated between Mikhail Gorbachev and George Bush) to completely withdraw all intermediate-range nuclear missiles from Europe. Furthermore, that was accomplished by the early 1990s.
Even if the Ukraine were to join NATO, it would not mean the installation of nuclear missiles in that country.
(Anyway, NATO already has three members - Lithuania, Latvia and Estonia - who share common borders with Russia. Are nuclear missiles installed in those countries?).
As a casus belli, I think this one is something of a red herring.
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TD
Or is that just too simplistic a reason.
People seem to prefer YouTube videos over boring, old print, so here is a rather depressing summary by a U.S. geopolitical analyst:
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mikeflood
Incredibile that I started this thread two years ago and things in Ukraine are more or less the same ..
Anyway the US and the UK are suggesting to allow Ukraine to use long range missiles against Russia....Putin is saying that if that happens it would "direct involve the US and allies in the conflict"...
Russia has allowed so many red lines to be crossed that the words of the late Sen. Mcain are becoming the truth "Russia is a gas station disguised as a country"
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TonusOH
If the US and UK are making that suggestion, it would imply that things are not going well for Ukraine. They've already crossed the line by openly supplying Ukraine with money and equipment. Encouraging them to escalate is pretty close to the line of committing an act of war. The question is what will Putin do about it? The more concerning question is, what options does he have? Because he does not seem to have many, outside of the use of nukes. And while it seems totally counterproductive to use them, if Putin ever decides that he has nothing to lose...
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road to nowhere
A radio host analyzed it as Russia is a huge slow moving country; hard to start and harder to stop. The leaders are willing to sacrifice millions of soldiers.
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Balaamsass2
During the 70s and 80s the USA successfully ground down the USSRs economy and moral until by after (Afghanistan)1990 they essentially went bankrupt.
I see the Ukraine war as doing the same thing. NATO and the USA are using the Ukrainians as a proxy to grind down and wear down Russia's military, economy and people.
The key factors are different. In the 80s you had a US actor,(a great poker player) Ronald Regan, who convinced the Soviets the USA had "star wars" and was willing to use it, and Gorbachev a moderate statesman, trying to improve an almost bankrupt Country, that was having difficulty producing/obtaining basic advanced technology (chips and transistors).
Today the problem is Putin is as "hard" and plugged in as Stalin, and Biden can't act OR play poker. He telegraphs and announces his every move and concern in the news media. China is supplying Russia with the latest tech, and seemingly could care less about US restrictions.
Russia has an almost limitless supply of bodies....if...the Russian people and Generals don't revolt. They don't have limitless money and tech. Russia's GDP is about that of Canada and Mexico...but with a bunch of old nukes. Tough one to guess about.
Look at the world GDP rankings.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(nominal)