Changing the Date of the Memorial?

by KalebOutWest 18 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  KalebOutWest

  I noticed in the latest Memorial Invitation, the dates for the observance are odd--well far more odd than usual.

  What I mean is that forever as I can remember, Jehovah's Witnesses use to advertise really big that this was NISAN 14. They don't tend to do this anymore.

  And being Jewish, their dates now tend to align with Passover, or at least with the second Seder night of Passover.

  2025: Saturday, April 12 (Nisan 15)

  2026: Thursday, April 2 (Nisan 15/16)

  2027: Monday, March 22 (Nisan 15/16)

  The last two are generally the 16th, depending on where you are on earth, but you see what I am getting at. None of these is in any way the 14th.

  It used to be that they were too, too early, like three days early sometimes. They would make a big deal saying how Jews were ways off and celebrating Passover on the wrong day. Now they are observing the Memorial on Passover because on each of these dates we are observing Passover too as we hold a Seder on the first and second nights, the 15th and the 16th.

  Did they change their calculation as of late? And why no mention of Nisan 14 like they used to do? Are they no longer sure?

  Lunar months are 30 days. All Jewish feasts (except for Chanukah) land on the 15th, so we can celebrate under the full moon (Jewish days begin at night, so this aided in holding a big party at night). The moon is full on the 15th (not 14th) on a lunar month, and thus Passover like all the other feasts begins on the 15th, not the 14th. I think they just learned this and have quitely shifted things perhaps? It was the Millerites who made the mistake of the Passover on the 14th, and Russell carrying that over. I was wondering if they were ever going to catch on.
• 

  blondie

  Can you briefly say when it changed?
• 

  KalebOutWest

  I am thinking that they may have just done this right now, this year.

  2020

  MEMORIAL : April 7--Nisan 14

  PASSOVER: April 8--Nisan 15

  2021

  MEMORIAL & PASSOVER

  March 25 -- Nisan 15

  2022

  MEMORIAL : April 10--Nisan 10

  PASSOVER : April 15--Nisan 15

  2023

  MEMORIAL: April 4--Nisan 14

  PASSOVER: April 5--Nisan 15

  2024

  MEMORIAL : April 12--Nisan 4

  PASSOVER: April 22--Nisan 15

  So now things have changed drastically since last year. How are they calculating things? Why no mention of Nisan 14 on their invitations anymore? I used to remember that and how we used to talk about that in our door-to-door work and with our Bible studies. We used to point that out with the unique Bible readings marked on the calendars that Bethel used to print for us (remember those?). It's not anywhere on the invitation any longer.

  Notice now the change again in the dates.

  2025

  MEMORIAL/PASSOVER

  April 12--Nisan 15

  2026

  MEMORIAL: April 2--Nisan 16

  PASSOVER: April 1--Nisan 15

  2027

  MEMORIAL: March 22--Nisan 16

  PASSOVER: March 21--Nisan 15

  Strange, no?
• 

  St George of England

  The Memorial talk likewise changed some years ago though I cannot remember just when. There is no longer any mention of the Passover, the flight from Egypt, Nisan 14 or anything associated with it. They even removed the old Memorial song.. "'Twas NIsan 14 when your glory was seen..."

  Personally I think they have realised their calculations have always been wrong so rather than admit it they have just dropped mention of it. A bit like the Creative Days.

  I have always thought their interpretation of "between the two evenings" to be nonsense. Cooking a complete sheep in the that short "twilight" period on an open fire would be impossible, my wife cooks a lamb leg for longer in a fan oven!

  George
• 

  Duran

  The date is not wrong and there is no change to it.

  Nissan 14 is always the first full moon after the spring equinox.

  March 20, 2025, spring equinox

  Sat April 12 at sunset is Nisan 14.

  [21 “‘In the first month, on the 14th day of the month, you will observe the festival of the Passover.]
• 

  KalebOutWest

  Nissan 14 is always the first full moon after the spring equinox.

  Not on the Jewish calendar, Duran. I'm a Jew.

  There are 30 days to a Jewish month. Each month is Lunar. The middle of each month is the 15th. That is the day of the full moon.

  Passover 2025: NISAN 15

  While it is true that Jewish Scripture say that we are to "observe the festival of Passover" beginning on the "14th day of the month," that is because we begin doing that much like Christians begin observing Christmas on Christmas Eve, not on December 25th but on the 24th of December.

  On the 14th day of Nisan all the leaven in Jewish homes is to be gotten rid of, either by eating and using up, selling, giving away, or burning it. Back in the days of the Temple, at 3 pm, the priests began slaughtering all the lambs, thousands of them, for the Seder meals, as that was the only way to get a kosher lamb for your plate in those days. Josephus said that in 70 CE he counted 256,500 Korban Pesach (kosher lambs) prepared by sundown, the 15th of Nisan, the beginning of Passover. In 65 CE, Josephus claimed there were “not less than three million” that had gathered for the celebration.(Josephus, Wars, 2:280) Yet as Josephus, the Talmud, and all other historical records verify, the Jews have always observed the 14th of Nisan as Preparation Day and Nisan 15 as the 1st day of Passover.

  Use AI and ask if the Jews changed the date and you will see that this never happened. That is a Watchtower belief. It has always been on Nisan 15. The 14th is the eve, the day to prepare.
• 

  NotFormer

  "'Twas NIsan 14 when your glory was seen..."

  You're yankin' my chain! 😳 Please tell me that this wasn't a real line in a real song*! 🙄

  If real, tell me the name of the song, please.
• 

  KalebOutWest

  The Lord’s Evening Meal

  Song 87

  Jehovah, our Father in heaven,

  O this is a most sacred night!

  ’Twas Nisan fourteen when your glory was seen,

  Your justice, love, wisdom, and might.

  The Passover lamb was then eaten,

  And Israel’s twelve tribes went forth free.

  Cent’ries later our Lord his own lifeblood outpoured

  To fulfill this divine prophecy.

  (From the old brown song book, I think)
• 

  Duran

  Nissan 14 is always the first full moon after the spring equinox.

  I misspoke.

  Is this true or false:

  The Jews counted their months from new moon to new moon.

  Nisan 1 starts when the new moon nearest the spring equinox becomes visible at sunset in Jerusalem. Counting 14 days from that event, is always Nisan 14.
• 

  KalebOutWest

  We still count, just as we always have, each month, from new moon to new moon.

  Nisan 1 starts not with a visible event because the Great Sanhedrin is no longer in existence to validate it. It is calculated astronomically, as decided by the rabbinical patriarchate of the Great Sanhedrin.

  Prior to the fall of the Temple and the later Bar Kokhba Revolt, the Great Sanhedrin was moved from Jerusalem to Yavne and then to Tiberias.

  Because of this the Great Sanhedrin couldn't declare for the Diaspora when months officially began.

  It was before the Great Sanhedrin dissolved that Hillel II, around the year 358 CE, created the current Jewish calendar. Hillel II introduced fixed standardizations that aligned via astronomical calculations, preserving the Jewish lunar year. He also introduced improvements allowing the addition of leap months to keep the calendar aligned with the solar year as well as allow for an automatic determination of exactly when the new moon appeared over Jerusalem, good or bad weather, something impossible before. (You had to do visible determinations prior to this, weather permitting.) You could also go backwards in time to precise dates in history using the Jewish calendar and Jewish dates, unlike before, as well as into the future.

  This invention proved to be timely as the Great Sanhedrin was disbanded in 425 CE.

  Counting 14 days from from Nisan 1 is always Nisan 14, that is correct. Again, it is not a visible system.

  You cannot rely on the Spring Equinox due to leap years.