Well, lets just say this was one of my major hangups when I was w/ the JWs.. To think that the one you loved, & were married to, or if you were single never married before, & then making it to the new world not being able to marry again was such a horrifying concept..! I remember some pics being changed on the front pages of literature, or illustrations being changed inside of literature where once there were a wife & children meeting their father/husband in the graveyard after resurrection, & then they took the illustrations away, with maybe a whole family just welcoming back one of their children from the grave. Well, I asked my Mom over & over about this teaching, & she told me to ask the brothers... The brothers said that I would just have to have faith that things would workout in the resurrection, or that the Society would get new light about the subject, but that I should never question the Faithful & Discreet Slave. Have any of you heard any "new light" about this, or have any of you had this particular hangup? That is just one of the many teachings by JWs that made me doubt & leave .... And it's almost like they try to hide this teaching, or not bring it up for the sake of not knowing the real answer.... What do you think, or know about this?---kristine
If you die, you will not be allowed to marry in the new world....(?)
by FreeofGuilt 13 Replies latest jw friends
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Hamas
Hi
Personally I wasn't aware of this teaching, or it never actually hit me before.
I know that there was this one guy at my old congregation that got married then split up on the very first night ( crazy innit ) but they never actually divorced because there was no wrongdoing involved. Unfortuantely for him, that means he has lived the last 15 years a single man, safe in the knowladge that he can never date with the view of getting married, now or even in the 'new system'.
I used to watch him at the meetings, he sat inbetween two old ladies every time. How blind people that follow the Watchtower can be, devoting their whole life to a lost cause. When he seperated, the elders stripped him of his right to be an elder , seemingly forgetting Jesus words ' He without sin cast the first stone'.
One thing that I used to wonder about was being married for many years, then watching your partner die. Through lonliness, you marry again. In a few years, the 'new system' explodes onto the scene, the dead are now alive, and your old partner of many years comes back to see you with another person! I never thought I could live in those circumstances, given that situation.
All these little doubts must add up into one.
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freedom96
I always hated how the WTS seemed to think they had the answer for everything. I mean, who the hell are they to decide on a subject they know nothing about?
For them to say that no one will reunite with their spouse? That resurrected ones will never marry? Always sounded pretty damn boring to me.
I for one, did not look forward to the new system.
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worldlygirl
I agree with you, Freedom96... That fishing and toiling the earth may be great for the first ten million years or so, but after that I think I would lose interest.
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minimus
Jesus said," Those that have been counted worthy of gaining that system of things and the ressurection from the dead, neither marry or are given in marriage".
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caligirl
I remember asking about that and being told that since everyone is supposed to be happy, it obviously won't matter to the ones that can't be together. Never bought that explanation either.
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Nathan Natas
here are some citations to back up what Minimus said:
Matthew 22:30
For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.Mark 12:25
For when they shall rise from the dead, they neither marry, nor are given in marriage; but are as the angels which are in heaven.Luke 20:35
But they which shall be accounted worthy to obtain that world, and the resurrection from the dead, neither marry, nor are given in marriage.But consider if you will what the Watchtower taught in chapter 29 of the 1943 book, "THE TRUTH SHALL MAKE YOU FREE":
CHAPTER XXIX
THE THOUSAND-YEAR REIGNGLIMPSES of life on earth in the new world of righteousness are graciously given in the Scriptures of truth. After a victory song such as Moses and the Israelites sang on the east shores of the Red sea after Jehovah had engulfed the hosts of Pharaoh in destruction, the "great multitude" of the Lord's "other sheep" will receive instructions what to do. "For out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of Jehovah from [the new] Jerusalem; and lie will judge between many peoples, and will decide concerning strong nations afar off," at the battle of Armageddon. The Armageddon survivors will convert the instruments of mortal combat of the destroyed nations to purposes glorifying God. "And they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruning-hooks; nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more. But they shall sit every man under his vine and under his fig-tree; and none shall make them afraid: for the mouth of Jehovah of hosts hath spoken it. For all the peoples walk every one in the name of his god; and we will walk in the name of Jehovah our God for ever and ever."-Micah 4: 2-5, A.R.V.
The prophecy of Ezekiel, chapters 38 and 39, supply a vivid account of the final, all-out warfare of Satan's organization under his chief spirit-prince Gog against Jehovah's faithful remnant of spiritual Israelites and their companions at Armageddon. With an awe-inspiring demonstration of almighty power the Most High God destroys the wicked spirit and human enemies and vindicates his name. "And my holy name will I make known in the midst of my people Israel; neither will I suffer my holy name to be profaned any more: and the nations shall know that I am Jehovah, the Holy One in Israel." (Ezekiel 39: 7, A.R.V.) Then the prophecy describes how God's surviving people will dispose of the bloodstained combustible instruments of the enemy and will dispose of their bones scattered about and thus cleanse the earth.
The God of righteousness and holiness will no more curse the ground. Paradise will not be restored earth-wide immediately, but the Lord's "other sheep" will go ahead with subduing the earth under divine guidance and blessing. "Truth shall spring out of the earth; and righteousness shall look down from heaven. Yea, the LoRD shall give that which is good; and our land shall yield her increase." "Then shall the earth yield her increase; and God, even our own God, shall bless us." (Psalms 85: 11, 12; 67: 6) With no wars to ravage the land the earth will speedily become a Paradise, just as Jesus foretold in his comforting words to the friendly thief on the tree alongside him: "Verily I say unto thee this day: With me shalt thou be in Paradise." (Luke 23: 43, Roth.) In this blessed earth under Kingdom rule the "great multitude" of "other sheep" from all nations will enjoy peace and fellowship with the faithful men of old, the princely representatives of the kingdom of heaven. (Matthew 8: il; Luke 13: 2S, 29) In obedience to the divine mandate these righteous children of "The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace", will marry and bring forth children, not for trouble and death-dealing war, but to fill the earth. They will rear them with complete freedom from fear and "bring them up in the nurture and admonition of the Lord". (Isaiah 65: 20-25; Ephesians 6: 4) There will be no overcrowding of the earth. Just how long the filling of the earth to a comfortable extent will require is not stated. It was 427 years from the Flood to God's covenant with Abraham, and long before that covenant the typical fulfillment of the divine mandate by Noah's sons was accomplished.
The truth concerning the divine mandate was revealed in 1938. Now a question arises respecting those of the Lord's "other sheep" who die before the battle of Armageddon. Many of these in totalitarian Nazi-Fascist lands have died as faithful martyrs for Jehovah's name's sake, and many in other lands have died for other causes, but all standing the test of faithfulness and preserving their integrity toward God and his Theocracy. Will these have a part in the carrying out of the divine mandate in the new world?
It suggests itself as reasonable that, God having held this hope before them, and they having died faithful and blameless to him, he would not deny them the privilege of the divine mandate. Concerning God's judgment Christ Jesus said "He gave him authority to execute judgment, because he is a son of man. Marvel not at this: for the hour cometh, in which all that are in the tombs shall hear his voice, and shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of judgment."-John 5:27-29, A.R.V.; Douay.
The faithful witnesses and prophets of ancient time have an early resurrection to life because they have done good and passed judgment with God's approval. Those "other sheep" who since the Lord's coming to the temple for judgment prove their integrity to God and die faithful have likewise "done good" and hence appear to be in line for a "resurrection of life". Since 1918 Christ Jesus on his throne at the temple has been judging the nations and dividing the people as "sheep" and "goats". He pronounces favorable judgment upon the "sheep" and ushers them into life everlasting under the Kingdom. The "other sheep" do not come into judgment with the rest of humankind, who have "done evil". Reasonably, then, such "other sheep" as die faithful under judgment test before Armageddon is fought to the finish will be favored like the faithful men of old and will receive an early resurrection 'unto life' and before the divine mandate is completely fulfilled. This will privilege them to share in that joyful hope and service. Such favor to the resurrected "other sheep" will not be contrary to Matthew 22: 28-32. It will be no part of the coming forth of the unjust unto a "resurrection of judgment" because such unjust ones have "done evil"...
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Gopher
since everyone is supposed to be happy, it obviously won't matter to the ones that can't be together.
I heard that stuff too. It was mind-boggling to say the least. One presiding overseer told me that Adam and Eve were perfect and able to exercise "self-control" until after they got out of the garden of Eden, so too in the new world we would be perfect and our sex drive wouldn't be so strong.
Excuse me? Adam and Eve never "got it on" while perfect in the garden of Eden? Where does the Bible say that? OH ... I guess it would ruin the Genesis account, that possibility of having produced a perfect child before the fall from grace. The ONLY way the Genesis story (and the original-sin doctrine) could work out is if Adam and Eve were shown to have children ONLY AFTER their banishment from the paradise.
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Oroborus21
Gopher,
isn't it obvious (and fortunate in many cases) that it is possible to have sex and it not result in pregnancy. Even healthy couples with no fertility problems sometimes experience difficulty in conceiving a child.
The elder was wrong to assume no sex was involved for Adam and Eve. What we know is that they didn't have children while dwelling in the Garden but we don't know whether they had sex although it would seem likely given Adam's long observation of the animals and also given the pronouncement/directive and blessing to them by God to at Gen 1:28 to be fruitful and to fill the Earth with their offspring. This blessing and directive occurred while in the Garden and probably with little doubt they wasted no time getting started
As for the topic of the thread this resurrection issue, we need to separate what is divinely inspired in the Scriptures and what the real MEANING of those passage is from what the Society has said the meaning of those passages is--because as we all know the Society's record of interpretation/understanding is less than 100%.
The Society might be right that resurrected ones will not procreate (marry)--and maybe there will be some biological reason due to having a reconstructed/resurrected body (although it seems doubtful that this would be the case since God is capable of resurrecting and creating a body that functions in all of its capacities).
But in my opinion the Society's current teaching is in error on this point.
I believe that when the scriptures refer to the notion of being "given in marriage nor marrying" and being "as the angels" the real meaning has to do not with biological capacity or sexual interest but is in reference to the fundamental concern a personshould have in life (including if resurrected to life during the Resurrection.)
The Society says that being "as the angels," who are spirit creatures, means that a resurrected person would be "asexual" (in desire), which is supposedly as the angels are.
However, this is obviously scripturally unfounded for we have the very account in Genesis that Angels are fully capable of sexual desire and some even (when they were permitted to materialize) took human form and had sex with "the daughters of men" producing the "giant" Nephilim.
What the focus of these scriptures really is about is what a person should be concerned about in life (not death).
The Angels are primarilly concerned with their service to God and that is their primary concern that takes preeminence over all of their activity. While even they are capable of sexual desire, this desire is so below their princely work of worship and service that it is almost as though they haven't it at all.
Likewise in responding to the question of the Sadducees and the issue of marriage and being given in marriage during the Resurrection, Jesus indicated that such a resurrected person would find themselves principally concerned not with these affairs of everyday life but with more important things. However that does not preclude that marriage and procreation could occur during the Resurrection. (Necessarily, for many persons whether previously married or not, having sex and procreation would be intrinsic to real happiness in life.)
If we look at the context of these scriptures we see that Jesus was helping persons to understand that God is "not the god of the dead but of the living." He thus set aside the argument about the Resurrection that the Saducees were attempting to get him involved in and directed attention to what one should be primarilly concerned with: serving God in Life and not worrying about what happens at death (or in the Resurrection).
Remarkably, even the Society appears to have missed this point.
-Eduardo
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petespal2002
This is my BIG BUGBEAR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
It all seems to hinge on the fact that Jesus was talking to those with the chance of becoming the heavenly class in those quoted verses from the NT, where they would literally become like angels, who it would appear are without gender. Noone really knows what the outcome is for those of the other sheep, but one is meant to remember that Jehovah is "opening his hand and satisfying the desire pf every living thing" so we have to be patient and wait and see. My husband was married previously and widowed, but I would want him with me in the new order. It's all too complicated!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!