by blondie 33 Replies latest watchtower bible
Hi Blondie,Hope your husband is doing well. Great work again ! Could you help me out,I tried using my 2001 wt.cd to find the last time that the Society raised the question on the identity of Michael / Jesus.The lastest issue shown was the WT.1991,Feb,1,page17.
I know there was a later issue where-in they said they didn't know conclusively the I.D.of who Michael / / Jesus is.Now they say in this week's study article,that I reviewed with you here,that Michael IS Jesus ?
Thanks,Blueblades
Blueblades, based on this quotes from current WT publications up until 2001, I would say that the teaching is still that Jesus is Michael. Of course, the 2002 and 2003 WTs are not on the disk so they could have said with with a disclaimer but I don't remember it.
6/15/1998 WT p. 23 Jesus—The Ruler "Whose Origin Is From Early TimesIndeed, in his role as archangel, the Word is known as Michael, whose name means "Who Is Like God?" and indicates how he champions Jehovah against all who aspire to usurp God’s sovereignty.—Daniel 12:1; Revelation 12:7-10.
Daniel Prophecy (1999)
chap. 12 Strengthened by a Messenger From GodFirst of all, we note that Michael was called "one of the foremost princes" and "the prince of you people." Later, Michael was referred to as "the great prince who is standing in behalf of the sons of [Daniel’s] people." (Daniel 10:21; 12:1) This points to Michael as the angel assigned by Jehovah to lead the Israelites through the wilderness.—Exodus 23:20-23; 32:34; 33:2.
Lending support to this conclusion is the disciple Jude’s statement that "Michael the archangel had a difference with the Devil and was disputing about Moses’ body." (Jude 9) Michael’s position, power, and authority made him truly "the archangel," meaning "the chief angel," or "the principal angel." Most fittingly, this lofty position can be applied to none other than Jesus Christ, the Son of God, before and after his life on earth.—1 Thessalonians 4:16; Revelation 12:7-9.
Kingdom Ministry October 2001 p. 6 Theocratic Ministry School Schedule for 2002
No. 3: Is Jesus Christ the Same Person as Michael the Archangel? (rs p. 218 pars. 1-3)
rs p. 218 Jesus Christ (par 1-3)Is
Jesus Christ the same person as Michael the archangel?The name of this Michael appears only five times in the Bible. The glorious spirit person who bears the name is referred to as "one of the chief princes," "the great prince who has charge of your [Daniel’s] people," and as "the archangel." (Dan. 10:13; 12:1; Jude 9, RS) Michael means "Who Is Like God?" The name evidently designates Michael as the one who takes the lead in upholding Jehovah’s sovereignty and destroying God’s enemies.
At 1 Thessalonians 4:16 (RS), the command of Jesus Christ for the resurrection to begin is described as "the archangel’s call," and Jude 9 says that the archangel is Michael. Would it be appropriate to liken Jesus’ commanding call to that of someone lesser in authority? Reasonably, then, the archangel Michael is Jesus Christ. (Interestingly, the expression "archangel" is never found in the plural in the Scriptures, thus implying that there is only one.)
Revelation 12:7-12 says that Michael and his angels would war against Satan and hurl him and his wicked angels out of heaven in connection with the conferring of kingly authority on Christ. Jesus is later depicted as leading the armies of heaven in war against the nations of the world. (Rev. 19:11-16) Is it not reasonable that Jesus would also be the one to take action against the one he described as "ruler of this world," Satan the Devil? (John 12:31) Daniel 12:1 (RS) associates the ‘standing up of Michael’ to act with authority with "a time of trouble, such as never has been since there was a nation till that time." That would certainly fit the experience of the nations when Christ as heavenly executioner takes action against them. So the evidence indicates that the Son of God was known as Michael before he came to earth and is known also by that name since his return to heaven where he resides as the glorified spirit Son of God.Blondie (found using archangel in search on the CD)
Blueblades:
For a more complete picture of proof Jesus/Micheal are one in the same ala WT reasoning do a search on the WT CD for 1 Thes 4:16. While you're there, make a special note of the footnote beside the word *Lord in this text. (*footnote 16, I think).WARNING: NOT for the spiritually weak!.
Remember what the bible says about angel worship? If Jesus is Michael - quick search of Rev. 22:12 will also shed light on the confidence that the world should have in this or any other study article.
Thanks Blondie, I need these reviews to keep me informed. Helps with recognizing additional reasons for trend behaviors - selling property, wreckless spending, teenager crackdowns
will
Rbi8 1 Thessalonians 4:16
16
because the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a commanding call, with an archangel’s voice and with God’s trumpet, and those who are dead in union with Christ will rise first.
FootnoteRbi8 1 Thessalonians 4:16
"The Lord," ?ABVg; J 7,8,13,14 , "Jehovah."
Very interesting, Will Power.
Blondie
Given this quote from the Reasoning book:
and is known also by that name since his return to heaven where he resides as the glorified spirit Son of God.
shouldn't prayers at the Kingdom Hall be concluded "in the name of your Son, Michael. AMEN'?
Thanks for your hard work, Blondie.
outnfree
Well, I don’t know about that. Many people feel like JWs are terrorizing them by coming to their doors uninvited often. That is why so many would like laws preventing it. JWs terrorize each other at their meetings, scaring them into serving God, holding death at Armageddon over their heads. Can you think of more ways?
For starters.
Spiritual terrorism: "marking" talks, CO and elder "do more, do more, do more, and when you're done that, do some more" pep rallies
stealth bombs: WT literature filled with "loaded language" like labeling -- "apostates", "table of demons", and "weasel words" like "evidently", "apparently", "it is logical to conclude that...", etc.
MOAB: "...so and so is disfellowhipped from the x congregation..." without further explanation or charges or chances to explain your side
F-16s: the weekly and daily assaults on people who have said "NO" dozens of times but they just keep coming.
Suicide bombers: those that assault through mental gymnastics and guilt trips into thinking the big "A" is just around the corner therefore any of life's activities should be cancelled (1975)
Physical terrorism: the JW pedophile paradise (arguably you could throw spiritual and emotional terrorism into that too)
Thanks for the interesting article.
1975 here we come again.
Don't they ever learn, no one knows the hour or day. My god what if the world was not destroyed by fire or water this time. What if the world learned how to have peace and learn to get along. What if learning that God is a part of everyone and that we are all trying to attain spiritual awareness. What if the destruction doesn't come but a higher consciousness this time? Then what? All this raging fear and hopelessness will be for nothing but once again.
Raising another crop of terrified of life individuals. Someone has to keep the toilets clean. I did enough toilet cleanings in my day to last the rest of my life.
Cathy
Thanks ,Blondie and Willpower,that one footnote,demonstrates that you can't use that verse to identify Jesus as Michael,yet ,the Society does it anyway.
Also,Heb.1:---6.to me is conclusive textual proof that Jesus is not Michael.The book of Daniel,when carefully read, also demonstrates that Michael is just one of other ARCHANGELS,whereas, Jesus is the unique Son of God.
There is more ,but ,this will do for now.
Again,Blondie thanks for all your hard work involving "Comments from the wt."Willpower,thanks for that reference footnote too.
Blueblades
On this side of the Atlantic it seemed that the article was aimed at strengthening the resolve of the American dubs who must have taken a lot of stick for a "Neutral" stand while their country was at war recently. Also to show that such a stand is not pro terrorist .
Par 11 onwards skipped between Rev 12, 2 Chron 20 (Many centuries earlier) & Ezek 38 with hardly a word to link up these very separate scriptures. Convincing argument?? I think not!
It is nice to know that violence is to be eradicated from the Earth by means of the greatest act of violent terrorism ever envisioned . Come again next week for the next thrilling instalment .....
Incidentally, If you read the "Questions from Readers" in this issue you learn that it is allowable to have a pet put down if it is too old or sick to recover . "On your responsibility"
It is funny the things that people feel they have to ask and cannot work out for themselves
