Conversation with mom today re: apostate material

by Jourles 27 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  Jourles

  So my mom calls me up today here at work and asks me how things are going. She goes on about the usual stuff, latest gossip, and other things I don't really care to hear about. She asked me how I am coming along in my "studies" with my assigned elder. (What studies? Elder who?) I told her that we never met for any studies - I didn't say anything, and he never asked to meet up. I did say that I was still waiting for a response from the Society to my letter that I had sent in a while ago. Jeez, that was April or May. We would then go over some of the points made by the Society if they attempted to answer any of my questions.

  She also asked if I was still "hunting for news articles that blackball the Society." I told her that I didn't need to hunt for them - they usually appear on the front page of many news sites. Somehow she veered into asking me if I have been reading any apostate literature from the library or elsewhere. I asked her to define apostate literature. She said, "anyone that writes negatively about the WTS." Well, if you put it that way, no. I told her that anything I send to her via email is either a news article or quotes taken directly from Jehovah's own mouthpiece.

  She feels that I am being too critical of the Society.(duh) But when I sent her the quote from the WT saying to "critically examine it's contents," she didn't say much. (email is great...i can send off wt quotes in an instant!) At the end of our conversation I asked her if reading the WT pubs was equivalent to reading apostate material. She said, "NO!" I then asked her why she gets so defensive when I send her quotes from the WT pubs. She says I take it out of context and twist it around to fit my ideas. Gee, where have I heard that line before? I so badly want to tell her that the Society's own pubs are more damning than ANY "apostate" literature could ever be. Besides, how many here consider the pubs the True Source of apostate reasoning? You only need to go back about ten years to find "apostate" thinking, ideas that if you stuck to today would merit your df'ing.

  So do you really need apostate literature? I don't think you do. The publications do just fine.
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  Elsewhere

  apostate literature from the library or elsewhere.

  What makes everyone think that *I* am the one giving out apostate literature?

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  w58 5/1 p. 261 Is Your Religion the Right One? ***

  Are you willing to put your religion through such a test? There is nothing to fear, because if you have the right religion you can only be reassured by the examination. And if what you believe is not in keeping with the Bible, then you should welcome the truth, because it leads to light and life.
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  run dont walk

  So do you really need apostate literature? I don't think you do. The publications do just fine.

  How true, we don't need any, the WTS puts their foot in their mouth all by themself, we just notice it, where as JW's don't.
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  Nathan Natas

  Ask your dear Mom which is "better" from the Watchtower point of view - reading material that follows the original teachings of Russell or material that criticizes Russell's teachings. Apply the same equation to Rutherford, and Knorr/Franz, since the society is now trying to disavow Freddie's fantasies as over-exuberance too.

  Was Rutherford "apostate" when he dumped Charlie's teachings? The Bible Students still think he was.

  Was Knorr/Franz "apostate" when they moved away from Rutherford's alcoholic delusions?

  Is Jaracz "apaostate" for moving away from Knorr/Franz?

  Are we "apostate" for moving away from Jaracz?

  A clear pattern of behaviour is evident: each Watchtower "regime" disavows the errors of the previous regimes and teaches the flock that their present dogma MUST BE BELIEVED.
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  drwtsn32

  Jourles, sounds like a discussion I could have had with my own parents.

  I sent her the quote from the WT saying to "critically examine it's contents,"

  Do you know off hand what you quoted for this statement?
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  pettygrudger

  Jourles - hats off to you for making such valiant efforts!!!

  I think your mother is probably rueing the day she encouraged as much personal study as possible!

  Hopefully this isn't too emotionally draining for ya! (I know it is for me when I had "those talks" with my mother.

  Hey - meet-up you gonna make it?
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  blondie

  "Hang them by their own words."--Blondie
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  Jourles

  Just what the doctor ordered:

  *** w50 8/15 p. 263 Name and Purpose of The Watchtower ***

  However, The Watchtower does not claim to be inspired in its utterances, nor is it dogmatic. It invites careful and critical examination of its contents in the light of the Scriptures. Its purpose is to aid others to know Jehovah and his purposes toward mankind, and to announce Christ’s established kingdom as our only hope.

  You gotta love that quote.
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  Jourles

  Hey Petty, I have been going around in circles for the past couple of years with my mom. Probably in the last several months I have been only sending her scanned documents from the Society and other schtuff. She debates very well and I have to say I love going up against her on many topics. She keeps me on my toes and provides great lines of thought that I can use in the future against other witnesses. Talk about mental gymnastics! She manages to come up with reasonings so well presented, she gives me a run for my money. But in the end, it is always the same. A simple WT publication quote or scanned document shoots down any argument that she makes. There are a few topics that she totally avoids now by merely stating, "Oh, I haven't had time to look that up or research yet." That has to be the easiest cop-out for a jdub.

  We'll see about the meetup. Late afternoon/evening ones are difficult for me to make.

  Nathan, I've used those arguments in the past. Her explanation is always the same - The light gets brighter. Continuous refinement. It is much easier to address current issues that affect us. Dragging up outdated quotes, according to her, only proves that we are a much better organization today than we were in the past. "At least we are willing to change, unlike Christendom."
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  drwtsn32

  Thanks for the quote... it's another gem in my collection.