by James Mixon 41 Replies latest jw friends
When multi-billion dollar companies are paying less in tax than small family businesses ... something is very, very wrong. Even worse when some of their employees need federal assistance - the taxpayer is literally making up their wages.
Artificially benefiting these companies is NOT capitalism at work. Market forces should benefit the good companies and the good employers but for this to happen we need the playing field to be level.
The question was ask "will pay increases lead to machines replacing workers'?
After the minimum wage ordinance was approved an owner invested in a $150,000
industrial dishwasher he had been eyeing to save on utility costs. The machine
also will allow him to stop paying six to eight people who earn $10. to $11. an hour
washing dishes. The owner expects to recoup his costs in nine months and
save a couple of hundred thousand dollars a year.
Education is not always a solution to higher income. In 2009 I was a manager at Walmart hiring people from the real estate and hotel industry at $8.15 an hour. Many of them had bachelors and higher, with previous incomes above $70,000. In Florida the unemployment checks were not that high, I think $275 a week max and maybe $300 with the temporary federal subsidy that was offered at the time. So some people preferred to work two jobs vs a low check. Just a miserable experience to go from $70,000 to two $8 an hour jobs.
Companies took advantage of this time to keep pay stagnant despite the fact in many of the industries profit was continuing to rise. What some people don't understand is that there are many billion dollar corporations that pay less than 20% in taxes. They use tax loop holes that are legal but really don't make any sense. For example they will claim an item to be both a debt and an asset over seas. PepsiCo uses three non-current liability category to deferred taxes on 2.3 billion in guarantee income.I recall the IRS suing them and PepsiCo winning.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/09/25/us-pepsi-tax-idUSBRE88O19R20120925#EUOXDvdBhB4BkUbf.97
Then you have companies like walmart that pay 39% in corporate taxes but yet so many of their employees are being subsidized by the tax payer. Though they are increasing their minimum wage to $10 and dept manager to $15 next year.
There is no simple solution hence my previous snarky $50 an hour comment. If minimum wage is brought up too high then CNA who take care of the elderly are not going to do that tough job when they can earn the same at McDonald. I will have to wait and see how Seattle does in the next few years. I'm interested on the impact it will have on teacher's pay and nursing assistant pay.
adjusted knowledge:
If minimum wage is brought up too high then CNA who take care of the elderly are not going to do that tough job when they can earn the same at McDonald. I will have to wait and see how Seattle does in the next few years. I'm interested on the impact it will have on teacher's pay and nursing assistant pay.
They won't do a good job because they can work at McDonalds? McDonalds is grueling work. Besides, they could pick and choose from whatever minimum wage job they're attracted to.
I should also say that if Minimum wage goes up then other wages, let's say $15-$20 should also go up somewhat.
Village Idiot
They won't do a good job because they can work at McDonalds? McDonalds is grueling work. Besides, they could pick and choose from whatever minimum wage job they're attracted to.
Where did I ever state "they" wouldn't do a good job. Another example of someone reading something that was never stated and that is even after you quoted me. I will clarify what I meant. A Certified Nursing Aid that is responsible for Alzheimer and other vulnerable elderly patients which includes bathing, lifting, perineal care (washing private parts), changing diapers, toileting, feeding and so on is much harder than a fast food or retail job. I know because I've done all three. My point is that jobs that require very specific job skills and further education may suffer if the same can be earned at less demanding jobs with fewer skill sets needed. Do you disagree and if so explain without generalizations.
I should also say that if Minimum wage goes up then other wages, let's say $15-$20 should also go up somewhat.
And what is that "somewhat" amount? A teacher that is required to have four years of higher education, take four certification exams, and complete two semesters of teaching should earn the same as a 18 year high school student at Mcdonald? $15 an hour equivalent is about $30k a year with no overtime. A starting teacher depending on the state and county can vary at $28,000- $36,000. Pension plans for teachers are being threaten and the hours teachers put in is more than what the typical person thinks (lesson plans, grading, conferences ect...)
The main point I'm making is that the problem with income disparity isn't as simple as raising minimum wage. And the argument that other wages will rise or should rise is not valid unless you can show me proof of that happening here in America. Hence, the reason I'm interested in seeing the outcome in Seattle over the next few years. I'm in agreement a person should be able to support themselves on a full-time job regardless of job.
What people sometimes don't acknowledge is that low wage workers sometimes earn so little they end up getting government benefits, so the tax payers end up partially funding these low wage jobs. The businesses that pay these wages are basically getting government funding to keep their prices low, that is not a good use of taxpayer money in my opinion.
Of course simply raising the minimum wage is not a cure all, and raising it too much would be counter productive, which is why no one is really suggesting $50 an hour, but I do think the wage we are paying now is too low. If a person is able and willing to work a full time job then they should be afforded the dignity of enough money to keep them off government benefits.
Lisa Rose, I agree. Just read and article about how it's working out for SOME people in Seattle . They are asking for their hours to be cut. They no longer get their EBT card(food) so there goes their free phone. Their subsidized rent goes up, So by the time they pay for food, phone and higher rent they are not better off, maybe worse.
If their employer cuts their hours I guess thats cool, who wouldn't want to work 20 hours instead of forty....lol
But if they won't cut their hours ? Well at least the tax payers are better off .
Sherry
adjusted knowledge:
"Where did I ever state "they" wouldn't do a good job."
You said: "If minimum wage is brought up too high then CNA who take care of the elderly are not going to do that tough job when they can earn the same at McDonald."
That implies that those who are doing that job are going to want to work elsewhere. Many people won't do that good of a job if they're distracted with thoughts of getting another job.
"I should also say that if Minimum wage goes up then other wages, let's say $15-$20 should also go up somewhat.
"And what is that "somewhat" amount? A teacher that is required to have four years of higher education, take four certification exams, and complete two semesters of teaching should earn the same as a 18 year high school student at Mcdonald?"
That somewhat amount is going to vary depending upon conditions in the job market. Let's say $5 above minimum.
Bottom line is that you can justify starvation wages with all of these arguments. So the question is:
What do you think minimum wage should be?
What do you think minimum wage should be?
I don't know as it is beyond my expertise.
I do believe mid to large size companies (50+ employees) in America could easily afford to pay $10 or more an hour and remain profitable. Perhaps $15 an hour is reasonable I don't know nor am I arguing against it.Wages and minimum wage specifically has not kept up with inflation. My only argument is the solution to income disparity and wealth isn't as simple as raising the minimum wage. Addressing wealth inequality involves tax reform, controlling cost of consumable items, and medical cost among other issues.
Again I'm really interested in seeing in 2018 and 2019 the impact Seattle wage law will have. It is a better snapshot than say looking at Denmark or Finland.
I would like to state that I understand the viewpoint from both prospective. I've implemented a career change this year and quit my job as a manager. I am going to school to become an RN. I went from making $60,000+ a year to $10.50 an hour and I can only work 24 hours a week. Nursing school is very intense and I am unable to work more hours. I'm in the hole about $2000 a month and don't qualify for any government aid because of my assets. I also don't qualify for student loans nor government grants as I have too many credit hours completed and only qualify for financial aid if I am earning a graduate or higher. So I do understand how hard and impossible it is to support a family on $8 or even $10 an hour especially without government assistance. I do get to test out the Affordable Care Act next year and get a tax credit for that.
