Earlier you assumed that the "minimum facts" were historical
SB, I don’t understand what you mean by this? What minimum facts did I assume were historical?
It seems that you no longer believe that being "deluded" is an adequate explanation for the events described.
When I used the term “deluded” it was in reference to the Jews making Saturday their day of rest and worship and change it to Sunday, and to JWs not celebrating Christmas because they believe Jehovah disapproves. ---------Nothing else
And I was not calling them delusional, ------------I was saying they were deluded, (big difference) which simply means; (deceived by false beliefs)
Case in point, I don’t “Believe” (Meaning, I don’t have proof because God hasn’t spoken to me on the subject) ----that God would want any Jehovah Witness to be disfellowshipped and shunned by family, just because they celebrate Christmas. That equals being deluded or another way of saying it is; (deceived by false beliefs)
As far as the 12 minimum facts you posted, I have no problem with any of them. And I believe it’s possible James saw “Something” and it’s possible Paul heard a voice. And for “Them” those personal experiences cause them to convert to early Christianity.
without providing for any apparatus, religious, educational, social or familial impetus that could account for this proposed delusion ---------right in the heart of Judaism.
SB, I think you have the word delusion—vs---deluded confused. I posted the definition for deluded above.
Delusion or delusional is more of a condition or a disorder.
I’m not saying they are “Delusional”
A delusion is a fixed belief that is not amenable to change in light of conflicting evidence.
As a pathology, it is distinct from a belief based on false or incomplete information, confabulation, dogma, illusion, or some other misleading effects of perception as individuals with these beliefs are able to change or readjust their beliefs upon viewing the evidence for these beliefs.
Delusions have been found to occur in the context of many pathological states (both general physical and mental) and are of particular diagnostic importance in psychotic disorders including schizophrenia, paraphrenia, manic episodes of bipolar disorder, and psychotic depression.
Delusions are categorized into four different groups:
Bizarre delusion: Delusions are deemed bizarre if they are clearly implausible and not understandable to same-culture peers and do not derive from ordinary life experiences. An example named by the DSM-5 is a belief that someone replaced all of one's internal organs with someone else's without leaving a scar, depending on the organ in question.
Non-bizarre delusion: A delusion that, though false, is at least technically possible, e.g., the affected person mistakenly believes that they are under constant police surveillance.
Mood-congruent delusion: Any delusion with content consistent with either a depressive or manic state, e.g., a depressed person believes that news anchors on television highly disapprove of them, or a person in a manic state might believe they are a powerful deity.
Mood-neutral delusion: A delusion that does not relate to the sufferer's emotional state; for example, a belief that an extra limb is growing out of the back of one's head is neutral to either depression or mania.