by cofty 87 Replies latest jw experiences
We need a 'Cofty' phone app like the Reasoning from the Scriptures and "When Someone Says," to read from and deal with witnesses/reality. I know we need to be able to 'splain in our own words but eventually it would become our own kind-a like - you get the idea.
Amazing, this post has me reading about 'vestigial' features. Curiosity wins over and that's the idea.
Hmmm...I don't think that this argument is going anywhere.
Glad to hear that this polite young man at the Trolleys spoke kindly to you, and listened. The real story is why did the sister stay away?
They walked away and you walked away, and nobody convinced anybody.
The sister probably gave credit to the young man about his expressions, just like your Evolution friends have given you on this post
and life goes on
Cheers
Quarterback - Actually he wasn't a young man. You didn't read the OP.
He didn't become a JW until he was in his 40s. He was left in no doubt that there was a mountain of evidence for evolution that he had never considered. He was challenged for his intellectual dishonesty for promoting creationism without ever reading a single book that presents the facts for evolution. (did this touch a raw nerve with you?)
He now knows that Rom.1:20 cannot be reconciled with both theism and reality.
He now understands that equating evolution with moral nihilism is a fallacy.
He acknowledged to a total stranger his concerns over changes and failures of the organisation.
He heard a concise and powerful refutation of the blood dogma.
His confidence in his worldview has been significantly challenged. In future it might make a difference.
Isn't it strange that the one piece of superstition that JWs most commonly retain after leaving the cult is creationism? It is the one doctrine that is most easily disproved by objective evidence...
I keep reading it as a "literature troll".
Cofty said: I did suggest to John that he should check out "Why Evolution is True" by Jerry Coyne. Of all the basic books on evolution it is perhaps the easiest to grasp.
Oh, excellent, Cofty. I am glad you gave him somewhere to start. I like that you have a strategy to focus on more easier evolutionary concepts to grasp. Making it relatable is a great idea. Again, so well done.
Quarterback - "JWs do not take the Genesis account literally."
Oh, really?
Go to your local BOE and tell them that you don't believe that the Garden of Eden or Adam and Eve actually existed, and see what happens.
cofty - "Isn't it strange that the one piece of superstition that JWs most commonly retain after leaving the cult is creationism? It is the one doctrine that is most easily disproved by objective evidence."
Now there's some thump-you-over-the-head irony. :smirk:
Yes Cofty he was older than I thought or remembered. I was wrong on that one. But, he is still younger than I am,
This brother will probably just return to the Carts soon enough because he was kind to you, and let you go on about your knowledge. That is the new approach to the Public Witnessing. Don't argue.
I don't even want to argue with you. It's not that I haven't argued the subject before.
When I want to believe in Evolution I will go to Chapters and buy a good book about it. Perhaps it will be "Evolution for Dummies," or "Evolution for Seniors"
Quarterback, I would never expect you to do anything other than what you want to do and it's the same with what I would expect of Cofty. Cofty did what he did because at a certain level he felt the need and wanted to do it - and good on him. Yes, whilst the probability of a JW thinking for himself is pretty low, we know from our own experiences as JWs that the thinking process can and does begin and grow. Otherwise we would not be here.
At the same time, thinking for ourselves did not happen overnight - and it seldom was driven by a single issue or identifiable key moment. But it happens.
What I can say is this (based on my own personal experience and what many other ex-JWs have shared): It is not always so easy for JWs to "shrug off" a disturbing conversation with a non-JW, whether a former one or not.
Doubts niggle and chip away at taken-for-granted beliefs - and they certainly sap the desire to remain totally committed to a belief system.
When I want to believe in Evolution I will go to Chapters and buy a good book about it. Perhaps it will be "Evolution for Dummies," or "Evolution for Seniors"
How about when you just want to understand the other side of the argument? How about when you want to gain some insight into why all the supposedly blindingly obvious objections like irreducible complexity or the development of the eye are not sufficient to cast reasonable doubt on the overall theory of evolution? How about when you simply want to have some intellectual honesty and be prepared to gain some basic understanding of a subject you are so keen to dismiss?
