Saying hello for first time (page 3)

HereIgo

Hello Brother,

its always nice to have an active Elder on here. Your perspective and insight is valuable. Welcome! we are here to help.

freemindfade

Welcome. You may have some highs and lows on the journey out but overall your mental health and wellbeing will only get better with time.

Welcome, I also lurked a long time before slowly posting, sometimes I feel like - wow someone feels EXACTLY how I feel and it's really affirming. What you said about the GB- did it start during the 3 part wt where they completely changed the core belief that they (7 obscure) men are the faithful slave- not the 144,000? I read that article 3-4 times, prayed about it, endured the wt studies on it and could not resolve the truth in those articles. I simply saw it as them taking more power on and we Lowly ones having to believe cuz they said it...thoughts?

jp1692

pimojw: its really difficult to know what to say without giving away my identity.

Welcome!

Your concerns are understood. But it might help to realize that there are literally so many people that come here with almost exactly the same story that your identity is fairly safe-unless you post your actual name!

Actually, with the notable exception that I would never use the word "whilst" in a sentence, your OP would have perfectly fit me when I first came here ... and about 10,000 or more pimo JWs!

LettMorrisSplaneit

Hi PimoJw,

I'm glad you decided to post. 15 years of lurking must be a record :)

Anders Andersen

Welcome! I hope you have a good journey out of the Watchtower and into control of your own life, thoughts and decisions.

You've been here a lot longer than I am :-)

I'm here since about 2 years. After reading a sentence that triggered me regarding why I believed in God in the first place (Heb 3:4), I set out to prove to myself that

God exists
direct creation is true (and evolution is not)
the Bible cannot merely be the product of human wit but is unlike any other book ever written and divinely inspired
and evidence shows JW are the one true religion, while no such evidence exists for other religion's claims.

Well after thorough research I was forced to conclude none of it could be supported by evidence except the opposite of what I believed. Thus I exited JW. Of course, your mileage may vary ;-)

watching evolution v creation debates (and haven't decided which side I'm on)

Be aware that debates aren't exactly suited for presenting the overwhelming amount of evidence that exists in support of both the fact of evolution and the scientific theories that explain those facts.

And in many debates tricks are used to win the debate regardless of whose position is better supported by evidence.

Many scientists simply refuse to debate creationists because of that.

You be better informed if you simply started reading on the subject.

Pick up a book that does a good job explaining what evolution is, how it is understood to work, and what evidence exists to support it. You can only evaluate what you understand and know.

Then review the arguments and counter-arguments presented by each side. See what (physical) evidence exists in support of each argument. Evidence is more compelling than conjecture and empty claims.

Check sources and quotes! I have noticed that most creationists (including Watchtower!) quote scientists completely out of context. One can only wonder why they would need to resort to such dishonesty if their position is strongly supported by evidence?

Ah well, just 2 cents on my pet peeve :-p

I'm still unpleasantly surprised by how dishonest Watchtower is when discussing their views on this subject.

tornapart

Hi pimojw, I don't often comment on here anymore though I still read quite a bit but just felt I had to say hi as your words touched a cord with me. I too have struggled with many thoughts and teachings , trying to get my head round everything. Once you lose your faith in the WT it's so easy to lose faith in everything else too. I'm still unsure what to make of everything so I have just decided to enjoy the present, discard the WT teachings and try and live a good life. I still believe in God and still pray but not sure how much of the bible to still believe. I too love reading meletivivlon's website and it does help me to keep my faith somewhat, even though I still have lots of questions. I've had a little dabble with buddhist teachings too and like some of them very much. I found a good book to read called 'without buddha I could not be a christian' by Paul F Knitter. His wife is buddhist and he found a lot of ways to consider buddhist teachings and incorporate them into his christianity. It made a lot of sense to me. Hope you can find your way!

pimojw

Thanks for all your comments again. Ill reply to as many as I can, in reverse order:

Re creation v evolution, i should clarify, I DO believe in evolution. (in fact all jws are uber evolutionists they just dont know it. they think all animals have evolved from a very small number of kinds since 2370 bce - thats fast!). my question is re a creator starting it off and/or guiding evolution.i used to have a lot of faith, but wt has ruined it. I really hope to get it back, but am sure like many i will struggle with it for a long time.

I do not have a science background but have always read very widely. I have read a number of dawkins' books (selfish gene, blind watchmaker, god delusion come to mind) and many creationist books too. used to use them widely in talks.

re my paranoia, i can completely understand how it seems excessive! i do not think anyone is after me in particular, but i do know of several brothers who frequent forums like this who would know me instantly if i gave away any hints, descriptions of "privileges i enjoyed" etc. i dont want this. my experience is quite unique (although im sure we all feel like that)

its nice to hear so many comments of ones who feel, or did feel like me. i am not 100% healed yet, so i hope being here will help. im not even sure it will...at times i have had to have a break from reading this forum as it made me feel more anxious!

re the wt about the gb, yes it was certainly another nail in the coffin, but i was "raised in the truth". no one thing brought me in, and no one thing took me out (mentally).

another positive of still being in and an elder is that i can hopefully help with the terrible situation surrounding child abuse. many elders HATE the direction they are getting. they either go along with it , or kick up a fuss in a way that gets them removed and dfd. I know the system, i know how to deal with co's, the branch, and even WHQ. at the very least im on hand if anything happens locally.

a number of elders speak openly about their disagreement on issues to do with child abuse, money (being taken from congs, and the begging), treatment of sfts's who were "reassigned to pioneer service" (booted out), khs being sold etc. there is a LOT of dissatisfaction out there, but not a lot of will to deal with it.

Doubting Bro

Pimojw - Just wanted to add my welcome! Really looking forward to your contributions.

OnTheWayOut

Welcome to the posting side of this forum. For any readers who didn't get it, PIMOJW means
"Physically-In, Mentally-Out" JW.

I was (extremely shortly) where you are, but couldn't stay there. For my own reasons, I had to get away from it.
I won't lecture you on what you should do, everyone has their own path to follow, but please don't quickly dismiss the idea of stepping away from the elder assignment. It doesn't have to disrupt your JW family if you did it for health, financial, or just personal reasons that cannot be fully shared with family. Okay, done with that non-lecture.

I hear ya about creating a new email and being careful about getting caught involved in anti-JW stuff on the internet. As a faded JW, I still maintain many separate things. I am just less and less worried about it as time goes on.

As for the ideas you suggest here on page 3:

"...another positive of still being in and an elder is that i can hopefully help with the terrible situation surrounding child abuse. many elders HATE the direction they are getting. they either go along with it , or kick up a fuss in a way that gets them removed and dfd. I know the system, i know how to deal with co's, the branch, and even WHQ. at the very least im on hand if anything happens locally.
a number of elders speak openly about their disagreement on issues to do with child abuse, money (being taken from congs, and the begging), treatment of sfts's who were "reassigned to pioneer service" (booted out), khs being sold etc. there is a LOT of dissatisfaction out there, but not a lot of will to deal with it. "

Edited to add: I had comments here and they disappeared.

I wanted to say, you surely could be a big help to an individual in the congregation facing problems about abuse. You could help them to get the proper help.

But I wonder on the rest- did you actually stop WTBTS from getting your congregation funds? Did you prevent the selling off of a KH? I hope I am wrong, but I don't feel that one elder, well-intentioned and knowing their system, can make the tiniest difference to decisions made at a much higher level. I am glad you want to buck the system and stand up for some things. But I will say that you will probably be removed as an elder somehow if you have any success. If they cannot come up with charges, they would simply close and sell your KH and tell every other congregation that you are not recommended to be re-appointed. And I would be proud to be kicked out of the boys' club for such a reason.

Saying hello for first time