by Freedom rocks 77 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
Can I ask how many of you presently study or have studied both creation AND evolution theories to arrive at what you believe to be true now?
Creationists on here - have you also studied evolution?
With the amount of information available out there to study it's going to take me years to discover what I now believe. It's a journey I'm willing to go on though. From what I've learned so far I'm leaning more towards agnostic/atheist at present 40:60. That ratio will change as I learn more I'm sure!
waton,
A reasonable person could just as easily turn this around on you and state the there is no evidence of explosions creating order, information, physical laws, consciousness
Perry, sorry I missed your post.
Instead of an explosion I am of the view related to the "Dirac sea,hole". Penrose theories cited above, that the Big Beginning was a funnelled event with an energy input and the emergence of additional matter, endowed with the potential natural laws we live with.
Without attempting to personalize the power and intelligence to have such a self-regulating entity like the universe emerge, in my belief there is an infinite time and energy present for the work that was done. and
There is a worker.
PS. In the sciforum link above is shown that, if the universe doubled in size during a second today, that could be truthfully called an explosion, in the smaller, earlier universe, egg size, doubling per second was normal growth, not an explosion.
Perry is an idiot constantly baiting us.
He is a waste of time, and an idiot.
By the way, did I mention he is an idiot?
I have PROOF he is an idiot too. See a voice from the sky told me.
So you have to believe me.
Freedom Rocks - Yes I have investigated creationism in all its forms. To be fair there isn't much to study. Every argument can be distilled down to - 'complexity; therefore god'.
The most recent development is so-called 'Intelligent Design' movement, fronted by The Discovery Institute. If you want to know more about it let me know.
I have asked dozens of creationists the same question - 'What books that present the scientific evidence for evolution have you studied?' So far not one single positive response.
To be fair there isn't much to study. Every argument can be distilled down to - 'complexity; therefore god'. the same question - 'What books that present the scientific evidence for evolution have you studied?' So far not one single positive response.
Cofty, to be fair, The failed assumption with the argument of atheists parading human ingenuity in uncovering the complexity of life's history as evidence of absence of a creative process is that
The more complex the process discovered, the more unlikely it becomes that the process, and the material that it played out in, made itself.
In other words, the narrower the gap of our not understanding becomes for us, the more unlikely it becomes that this all worked so well without understanding and input just because ----there in no ultimate hidden cause.
Science, by it's nature is becoming ever more specialized. Books describing it,-- more convoluted.
The "wow" moment that comes from "studying" the books you referred, to leads to "wow" moments at the cleverness of their authors, when it should lead to an appreciation of the origin of such seemingly automatic processes.
My hat off to science writer, but they are, after all, only historians.
I like history, because everything we see comes from the past, is already old.
waton - You seem to be advocating a god-of-the-gaps.
Can I ask how many of you presently study or have studied both creation AND evolution theories to arrive at what you believe to be true now?
I am somewhat embarrassed to say that I was a gung-ho creationist decades ago. Accepting the fact of evolution was a slow and sometimes painful process.
waton - You seem to be advocating a god-of-the-gaps.
cofty, No I mentioned the gap, because our slice of comprehension is narrowed by ever better research, as we speak.
Previously, as you indicate, such missing understanding might be considered the domain of a deity. Today, remaining science questions are sought after fields for research. leading to ever better questions. But remember:
The answers are already there, have been for ages.
Of course it is exciting to think about the discoveries that future science will reveal, but there is enough, even in our personal lives to appreciate nature as we understand it now, and be in awe, even without Bach, Hayden or Vivaldi playing in the background.
The fact that science is proving so much, this is why the Borg discourages ''higher education'' so much. Because, it makes people think, it makes them realize things for themselves. Counteracts WT theology.
Counteracts WT theology.
Beth Sarim (not to be abbreviated to BS).:
because wt theology is stuck with cloning females from male ribs, talking snakes and reversing Earth rotations. If they reject that, they would reject, undermine their promised PP Paradise. because it is all all based on the same book.
Going from door to door standing at carts looking for dummies. but
accepting evolution and an atheist package with it,-- is not smart either, because it kind of negates looking for answers to the big, and open questions. The ultimate option.
Nothing wrong with evolution, since it has sex as an essential intregal part, --would not want do without it.
