The Devil, The Original Serpent?

by Faraon 15 Replies latest watchtower bible

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  greven

  when reading the rest of the ot you will see that the 'original prophecy' is not mentioned further outside of Gnesis. The ancient jews did not connect it to the messiah. This is also evident when looking at the gospels, which constantly claim Jesus fulfilled this Jesus fulfilled that...but the eden prophecy is not among them. So where did this idea originate? It was Paul wo came up with this idea. One man dying for all, satan being the serpent etc is all his' invention. This makes it all the more absurd because it would mean that the most important prophecy was unknown for hundreds of years, even when it was fulfilled!!

  Greven
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  gumby

  The sudden change God makes between a diety of vengeance in the old testament and a diety of love the new testament was something I had always been questioning for quite some time. Its part of what made me become a Gnostic.

  Enishi,
  

  This was also a biggy for me and was one of the major things I questioned. God was supposed to never change and always be the same. He kicked people's ass over and over, in the OT......then he sends his son to earth who is suppose to represent everything he stands for..........and he never retaliates...( except the temple scene)

  You will find the Jesus story of an actual historical person.........was invented by the church of the second century. The first gospel is thought to have been wtitten about 100 years AFTER Jesus supposed earthly life. Nowhere will you find in all the "letters" or (epistels)...any writer who mentiones Jesus earthly life nor ANY of the events. Also....early church fathers up to the 2rd century in defending a real Jesus......NEVER used the gospels to prove it. Why? There wasn't any to use.

  Jesus was thought of by early christians to be a spiritual leader.......not one who was a human and later acsended to heaven. Later, .......they were squelched, and the literalist christians took over and destroyed all who didn't agree with them and most of all gnostic and other pagan cultures and writings were destroyed..........nice eh?
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  Faraon

  Anishi,

  Moses might have kept his Egyptian name since it was in Egypt that he learned most of his spell-craft and esoteric knowledge

  Actually, Moses's name was Chaldean, the language spoken by hebrews and neighboring countries. This is puzzling because, to begin with, I cannot imagine a princess from Egypt giving him a hebrew name.

  Another problem with language would be that if Hebrews were slaves for more than three hundred years, they would speak Egyptian, not Chaldean or a derivative. Tell me how many Blacks speak the African language of their ancestors in America.

  One of the points of this thread is that according to Josephus, the snake was to be hit on the head by both Adam and his wife. Unless we have both a male and a female messiah, this was no prophecy.

  I read somewhere that there were two branches of religion: Mushite and Aaronite. With time, they even made them brothers, and the Aaronites wound up in charge of the temple.
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  Panda

  Moses is an Egyptian name.

  The magic he learned was from his education in Egypt.

  Of course all of this is supposing Moses was a real person, which of course he wasn't.
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  Faraon

  Although there is also a version of the name Moses being Egyptian in origin, the thing that clinches it is the explanation of the name's meaning. "drawn out".

  This would definitely make it Hebrew/Chaldean in origin.

  The whole story about him is crazy, anyway.

  A puzzling story is why Yaweh found Moses and tried to kill him. You can find this on Exodus 4

  24 And it came to pass by the way in the inn, that the LORD met him, and sought to kill him.
  25 Then Zipporah took a sharp stone, and cut off the foreskin of her son, and cast it at his feet, and said, Surely a bloody husband art thou to me.
  26 So he let him go: then she said, A bloody husband thou art, because of the circumcision.

  An interesting link supporting your claim can be found at http://www.bib-arch.org/bswb_BR/bswbbr1903f1.html#1. But like you say... If he existed at all.
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  AGuest

  briefly, if I may. May you all have peace!

  The word "original" as in "original serpent," is a mistransliteration. The true word is "arkaic"... which was misrendered to mean "ancient"... "old" or "original." In truth, it is referring to the "arkaic serpent"... one of two on the Ark of the Covenant.

  ALL spirit beings are "serpents". Not serpent, as in "snake" as we know it, but "serpent" as in "seraph/saraph"... which means "fiery serpent". All spirit beings are "saraphs," including my Lord: he is a copper "saraph" (depicted as such, based on his coloring).

  "Satan" and Michael were the two "cherubs" that were covering the Ark of the Covenant... positioned on the cover, with their faces toward the cover. The "cover" of the Ark... is my Lord: the Propitiatory. A "cherub" is not a TYPE of spirit being; it is a POSITION in the spirit world. Cherubs... are SARAPHS... who are in an elevated position. Angels... are SARAPHS... who are messengers. An "arkangel"... is a cherub/angel... whose position is directly related to the Ark.

  "Saraphs"... have wings and legs (as well as arms). Thus, when first placed in the garden, the "form" which Satan occupied also had wings and legs... which were subsequently removed. A snake, then, with wings and legs... is a "dragon." We also call a snake a "serpent," but that is because of religion's misunderstanding: a serpent also has wings and legs... for it is also a "dragon".

  Spirit beings are saraphs... fiery serpents. Those who are bad, who deal in death, are "vipers"... poisonous serpents. Those religious leaders who deliver God's sheep into death's hand, by misleading them, are call the "OFFSPRING" of "vipers".

  As for the similarities between ancient Egyptian beliefs and that of the Hebrews... there was little difference. The Egyptians and Hebrews at one time served the same God, JAH... of Armies. That is why Egypt was entrusted with the care of Israel for some 400 years. JAH would not have predestined Israel to end up in Egypt, He would not have sent Joseph ahead, Pharaoh would not have made Joseph his second in command... were these common beliefs not in place. Egypt and Israel... were allied... "brothers".

  The division came when Israel grew in population and the Pharaoh of such time was convinced to enslave them. As with all religion, it is when one faction begins to oppress the other that great division in beliefs come into existence. Catholics/ Protestants, Jews/Samaritans, Christians/Muslims... Christendom and, well, Christendom... etc.

  Moses was told to go to Pharaoh and say who it was that sent him: JAH... of Armies. Pharaoh, who believed himself to be a god, failed to acknowledge JAH... whom he did in fact know... for Israel had dwelled in Egypt for hundreds of years. Because He knew that Pharaoh would act as if he did NOT know JAH... JAH... caused his (Pharaoh's) heart to become more of what it was... obstinate. He gave to Pharaoh according to Pharaoh's own heart... such that what Pharaoh himself WANTED... came true.

  I bid you peace.

  A slave of Christ,

  SJ