Creationist threatens academic science standards group with words of Jesus (page 6)

barry

One theologan I have a great deal of respect for said ' The bible tells us how to get to heaven not how the heavens go'.

hooberus

It is a wonder if Creationists recognize that Haeckel's theory of recapitulation is not a fundamental piece of evidence of evolution, then why do they harp on it and Haeckel so much? Maybe because Haeckel's work has value and is still referred to today, though not his theory of recapitulation. I guess the theory goes if you demonize recapitulation, you demonize all of his work, which makes modern evolutionary theory look like it's on shaky ground. Again, misconceptions used as evidence against evolution.

Creationists recognize that that Haeckel's theory of recapitulation is not a fundamental piece of modern evolutionary theory. The AIG arcticle even quotes Gould to that effect:

E.g. evolutionist Stephen J. Gould has said, ?Both the theory [of recapitulation] and ?ladder approach? to classification that it encouraged are, or should be, defunct today.? Dr Down?s Syndrome, Natural History, 89:144, April 1980, cited from Henry Morris, The Long War Against God, Baker Book House, Michigan, p. 139, 1989. Return to text.

The reason why creationists harp on Haeckel is because these same false drawings have been and are still being used as "evidence" for evolution in school textbooks.

Your charge that creationists engage in "misconceptions used as evidence against evolution" is false.

Earlier you made the claim: "By making it appear that Haeckel's drawings are an important part of the modern theory of evolution and discrediting them, Creationists commit the strawman fallacy."

Please show me where creationists such as AIG make it appear "that Haeckel's drawings are an important part of the modern theory of evolution."

Talk about pulling it out of your ass ! That guy haeckel sounds like your typical evolutionist . That is classic evolution . How many more frauds must people face before before they realize the evolution science community cannot be trusted . BTW ---I think I did see those drawings in my 6 th grade science book .

Abaddon

Mr. Kim; as I thought, all talk and no trousers. You're also apparently a liar, as you seemed to claim to be part of the "elite scientific community" (whatever the hell that is).

I do have to ask you this though, as your phrasing is curious in this quote from the thread about Bush being stupid;

And I guess the human side of me will always make mistakes now and then.

... and what is the other side of you Mr. Kim?

Heathen; I'm afraid I find your behaviour typical of many Creationists - you have not dealt with the questions raised by your posts, which as they stand are a fallacious tissue of ignorance over a subject you apparently consider yourself qualified to lecture on.

hooberus; I have unrefuted posts Jerry Bergman promised to address some time ago that relate to dishonesty and scientific incompetance as practised by creationist of various afiliations; as your argument at the moment is apparently based on similar coincerns with evolution I have to ask why you haven't investigated the cases of dishonesty and scientific incompetence in creationists I provided.

Do you have a double standard, whereby you will accept creationist arguments even if evidence is presented against them, and whereby you will ignore evolutionistic arguments due to their origin, rather than their content?

It seems you do...

Abaddon

Kaethra: Yes, it is! Delilah asked I blur her face, and I blurred the 'naughty bits', otherwise someone looking to take offense would.

It's from our holiday in France earlier this year *sigh*

Bliss... two weeks of perfect weather, wine so cheap if you'd not tasted it you'd have thought it was bad based on the price. Good, fresh food... oh I want to go back!

drwtsn32

Wow Heathen.... I am embarrassed for you. Your lines of reasoning are... incredible.

A while back you basically said you didn't want to believe in evolution. To each his own...

czarofmischief

I'm not paying taxes to have the Moral Majority fundamentalize my kids. Nope. Not gonna happen.

I'm not opposed to a religious survey class - but if you teach the Christian myth, you must teach all the rest and present religion as it really is - mankind's spiritual evolution (hahaha) as we search for meaning in the face of our individual death.

I think that evolutionary education has a long way to go. This thread should be required reading. I mean, polished up a bit. However, scientific education is fairly general in every case - and is meant to spark individual research on the part of the student. So, in the science classroom, creationism is simply not a valid enough theory to present to kids - it pretends to be able to have all the answers in a twelve page photocopy.

turn about is fair play! If we are going to go into all of science's many failures, than how about if we discuss religions many failures to provide moral guidance in times of crisis? Hm? The Crusades, the Inquisition, the witch burnings? And I don't mean just a historical overview, I mean, grab a minister, stand him up in front of the class, and hammer him with questions about where God was exactly at that moment and why exactly he let each and every baby die, and if He cares so much about abortion why doesn't He do something about it?

Evolution science is a series of questions about where and when and how we came into being. Creationism pretends to have all the answers already. Parents can teach that nonsense if they want to, but I'm not paying for it.

CZAR

rem

Hooberus,

You have made my point for me yet again. Still you are talking about Haeckel's theory of recapitulation. Haeckel's other work, which includes noticing the similarities between organisms during fetal development, are still considered valid today. The misconception, which you are now employing, is implying that having any of Haeckel's drawings in science text books as evidence of Evolution is fraudulent or in error and makes it look like scientists are relying on shaky evidence to hold up the theory.

This misconception (or should I say misrepresentation?) is advanced to cause doubt in students about the foundations of the theory of evolution and make them think there is controversy about it. Again, this is part of the wedge strategy that is employed by Creationists - it is no secret. You yourself know that creationists have tried to put, and some times succeded in putting disclaimers within science text books stating that the theory of Evolution is considered contriversial.

Please don't insult our intelligence by implying that creationists are only interested in accurate science. Creationists have been trying to get their religion taught in science classes and text books for years. The agenda is transparent.

rem

Heathen,

Are you saying that typical evolutionists are frauds? What evidence do you have for this claim? Do you know that certain creationists have employed fraud to advance creationism? Shall I start calling all Creationists frauds?

How many more frauds must people face before before they realize the Creationist community cannot be trusted?

I know that is what happened to me... after seeing examples of fraud and misrepresentation I found that I could no longer trust everything that Creationists were saying. That compelled me to do real research. Maybe someday you will do the same.

rem

heathen

Rem--- I think most creationists are idiots as well . It is clear that the earth was not created in 6 -24 hr days and no the dinosaurs did not perish in the flood of Noah .

Abaddon -- go screw yourself .

Creationist threatens academic science standards group with words of Jesus

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