Is Belief in Jesus Enough to be Saved? Or Does it Include Believing Jesus?

by Sea Breeze 25 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • joey jojo
    joey jojo

    I believe Jesus probably existed.

    I also believe that for someone that is supposed to be the son of god / god , he didn't really say a lot of helpful things.

    I mean, every word he spoke should have been recorded. Why didn't someone ask him about cancer/ malaria/ clean drinking water/ dental hygiene/ electricity/ the best possible diet that lets the average person live a long, healthy life? His message was basically, " don't worry - it will all make sense after you die".

    This was an opportunity to really lift the everyday existence of the average human. Its only now , 2000 years later that humans have been able to figure all this stuff out on our own, at the cost of millions of lives.

  • Sea Breeze
    Sea Breeze
    Why didn't someone ask him about... the best possible diet that lets the average person live a long, healthy life?

    I think because he didn't come to fix symptoms, He came to cure the disease.

  • joey jojo
    joey jojo
    I think because he didn't come to fix symptoms, He came to cure the disease.

    Well - 2000 years later. What has changed exactly?

  • Sea Breeze
    Sea Breeze

    A lot. Jesus is widely recognized as the most dramatic change agent in all of history. The whole world counts time by this mans life.

    Jesus profoundly changed people’s understanding of love and forgiveness. His emphasis on unconditional love (agape) for all, including enemies, and teaching that forgiveness should be offered freely and repeatedly was a radical departure from the norm. This ethic continues to inspire social movements and conflict resolution efforts today.

    Jesus elevated the status of women and children, who were often marginalized. He included women in his ministry, taught children as valuable members of the community, and challenged social norms regarding their treatment. This had a lasting impact on views of human dignity and rights.

    Jesus’ teachings significantly influenced education, literacy, social justice and intellectual pursuits. The Christian emphasis on studying scripture promoted literacy. Christian institutions played a major role in preserving knowledge and establishing universities.

    Jesus' self resurrection from the dead transformed views on death and the afterlife, reframing death as a transition to eternal life rather than a fearful end. This gave his followers courage in the face of persecution and continues to provide hope and purpose for many. His teachings on judgment based on how one treated “the least of these” have motivated ethical behavior and social responsibility.

  • joey jojo
    joey jojo
    Jesus elevated the status of women and children, who were often marginalized. He included women in his ministry, taught children as valuable members of the community, and challenged social norms regarding their treatment. This had a lasting impact on views of human dignity and rights.

    And yet - slavery was all good.

  • Sea Breeze
    Sea Breeze

    @ Joey jojo,

    slavery was all good

    You said that, not Jesus.

  • Halcon
    Halcon
    SB- The Watchtower and every JW that I have spoken with denies that Jesus raised himself from the dead. Was Jesus lying?

    Is this truly correct tho?

    When Jesus spoke of raising himself, it is understood that 'himself' is referring to the essence of God. But even that essence had to be separated into the form of Jesus as man (from the Father who always remained alive) in order for him to really die.

    Jesus the Son still depended on the separate Father to raise him up. But because they are both of the same essence of God, Jesus said he raised himself. In reality the JW belief is not utterly different from just about all other Christian belief regarding this (even tho JW also claims to be innovative on this).

    The issue is in the understanding of this 'essence' of God and not necessarily on the technicalities of how the resurrection of Christ actually occurred, which is something that no human will ever truly understand.

  • TonusOH
    TonusOH

    JWs believe that Jesus and Jehovah are two separate persons, and that it was Jehovah who raised Jesus from the dead. They do not believe that they are two facets of the same being, or that Jesus returned himself to life.

  • Rattigan350
    Rattigan350

    "The Watchtower and every JW that I have spoken with denies that Jesus raised himself from the dead."

    Because a dead person can not raise himself from the dead. If he could he would not be dead. There is your paradox.

    "Was Jesus lying?" No, you just misinterpret one of his many cryptic statements.


    "No man taketh it from me, but I lay it down of myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. - John 10: 18"

    That is not his resurrecting himself.

    Actually he didn't have the power to lay down his life. He did it because his Father prophesied it and he had the power to take it up again because his Father prophesied it. His power to take it back came from his obedience.

    "Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up .... he spake of the temple of his body. When therefore he was risen from the dead, his disciples remembered that he had said this - John 2: 19-22"

    That's not a correct quote.

    "Jesus replied to them: “Tear down this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.”

    20 The Jews then said: “This temple was built in 46 years, and will you raise it up in three days?”

    21 But he was talking about the temple of his body."

    Jesus did not say what was in vs 21. Notice how that was in the 3rd person? John wrote that in retrospect, not Jesus.

    Was John correct?

    Was John saying the temple that was raised up was his body? It seems that the temple that Jesus referred to that would be torn down was his body when it died. But what he referred to that would be raised up was not his body, but the spiritual temple. That was put in action by his offering the value of his blood to his father in the 3 days.

    With his blood being offered as a sacrifice how could his body be raised without blood in it?

  • Halcon
    Halcon
    JWs believe that Jesus and Jehovah are two separate persons, and that it was Jehovah who raised Jesus from the dead.

    This is what all Christians believe. That God the Father raised God the Son from the dead.

    They do not believe that they are two facets of the same being, or that Jesus returned himself to life.

    Neither do Christians. Christians believe that the Father and the Son are two different beings sharing the same essence. It is thru that essence that Jesus could say he raised himself.

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