Atheist ? (page 3)

Doubtfully Yours

Although I'm in the middle of a slow exit from WTBTS land, I still believe in higher power(s).

Eventually I'll get a different translation of the Bible and read it from time to time.

DY

patio34

I echo Greven and Rem's posts, GentleSoul.

I wonder why theists feel the need so much to sway non-theists. Live and let live. Anyway you did ask why people are atheists after leaving JWs, so I'll put in my 2 cents in addition to the reasoning Greven and Rem offered so well.

I had a brainstorm one morning (but it HAD been building) after 28 years as an avid theist. See, it was never a question of which religion for me, but rather should there be religion at all.

The brainstorm came when letting my grandson watch the Disney movie, Dinosaur. It just hit me that the violence (prey/predator cycle) in nature started way before Adam and Eve supposedly existed. So, what did any supposed original sin have to do with dinosaurs (and many other creatures down to bacteria and viruses)? Nothing.

To me, that was the fatal flaw in the the whole theist argument: that no loving creator would deliberately create such violence and enormous and unimaginable suffering.

That just started my search and then I read books by evolutionary scientists themselves, not thru a religious filter.

And that's why I don't have a belief in a mythical super power, in addition to what Greven and Rem stated so well.

Good luck to you.

Pat

Blueblades

GentleSoul, Again,all that you are saying is based on a book.So let me explain as I have before.I will use your book the Bible.You remember the Apostle Thomas,don't you?Well,I pattern myself after him.I am a "Doubting Thomas".Thomas had much more evidence in the beliefs that you make, ( According to the Bible )Thomas walked,talked,ate,slept and observed miracles that Jesus did in his presence,for 3 years.

When Jesus said he would rise from the dead,Thomas heard it.When Jesus did rise from the dead,Thomas "Doubted it Happened".Jesus did not condemn him for having this Doubt.Jesus gave Thomas special consideration and appeared to him ( according to the Bible )

Why does he not do this for us in a quiet setting.Why is it taught that his second coming is to destroy unbelievers and doubters.Do you understand this at all,its why so many don't ascribed to a Bible - based faith one based on uncertainty and takes a great leap to secure.

You are basing all that you say and feel on a book that in itself is questionable by the translators and scholars and other fields of learned men.

When one says I have experienced personally God in my life,then that is for that person only,like Thomas,and only this convinces them,if it actually true.and that raises the next question for many others of us who ask ,why not me.?Again my response is based upon the Bible that I don't believe is the Word of God,yet I am answering you according to the book that you say is.

Blueblades

Carmel

I've discussed metaphysics with many atheists and find that we pretty much agree on what we don't believe in, that being the God that is described in the OT and what most contemporary Christians and Muslims believe in. Apart from that, I do believe in the existance of an inteligent creative force and so don't consider myself an atheist in the purest sense.

carmel

gumby

I wonder why theists feel the need so much to sway non-theists

Pat,

Theists who believe in the bible as gods word, feel a need to convert because that's what Jesus told his diciples to do, and that was the model his apostles set. An atheist has no book to direct his thoughts as far as converting goes.

When I think of what Rem said and think it could be true......that there is no guiding factor for our planet, and that we are vulnerable prey to whatever catastrophy could impact life on earth........it really makes me feel shitty about life to be honest. He could be correct in what he shared......or their could be a creator. I for now feel there is divine intelligence with some kind of purpose myself, but haven't a clue as to why there is no communication other than stories of the past.

Gumby

gentlesoul

I feel there have been no communication because Jesus was the fulfillment of all things and the need of such things no longer are needed. The only thing left to do now is his return. The reason for all the miseries on this earth is caused by Satan who is the ruler of this earth at this time, stated so in scripture, people ask or say why would God allow or cause such things to happen. Well he doesn't cause castrophies or miseries or sickness it is satan who causes such things. God is all about love and if we love him he loves us back, but Satan rather is all about hate. Remember that God created Adam and Eve to live originally in paradise forever as long as they followed Gods commands. Life was perfect then and was not until they disobeyed God that all the bad things in life began. So the blame is on satan and not God, he plainly says that if we follow his laws we will reap the benifit and if we do not we reap that benefit the same benefit that Satan will reap. It is no different than what we do when our children do wrong things when they do they are punished just as we were when were children.. So God being the father punish us the same as we punish our children...Make sense to me and I don't see why it is so hard for others to except that.

There were some post made here in this thread were the concept of faith was lost . If God made it so easy for us to believe then we would all be in heaven wouldn't we but it is up to us to pass the test and if we do we benefit from it greatly...

U.2.K. Tha Greate$t

Those who dont believe and care about GOD, puts aside theirself and they are the foolish ones.

drwtsn32

gentlesoul:

So all misery is caused by Satan? Does praying to God do any good? Does God ever intervene and make things right? If so, why does God wait for someone to beg him to help? If he had the power, shouldn't he fix things without requiring that people beg him for it?

If God made it so easy for us to believe then we would all be in heaven wouldn't we but it is up to us to pass the test and if we do we benefit from it greatly...

If God gave us this wonderful brain that has the ability to reason, why would he want us to abandon "reason" and rely on "faith" when it comes to his existence?

If God exists he is so much greater than we are. He may view us in a way that we would view a pet. (Yes, this is an oversimplification but bear with me.) We just want the best for our pet; do we really care if our pet does things precisely a certain way or demand that it begs for us to help it? No...we just want the pet to be happy.

Why would God be any different? Why do we humans tend to make God into this petty being who demands that we obey a list of rules in order to make him happy? I think it's because we want to be certain that we are pleasing God. It's much simpler when there is a black/white list of things we should do/not do. Man almost can't help but make a list of things we should and should not do to please God.

I'm thinking that if God does exist, he could care less about religion or even that people believe in him. He would simply want to do was is best for humankind... period.

drwtsn32

Those who dont believe and care about GOD, puts aside theirself and they are the foolish ones.

Ah...the tired old mantra of every religion. "Believe it or you are a fool." I want evidence! I want proof!

Satanus

If God made it so easy for us to believe then we would all be in heaven

Isn't that what god wants? If he truly is love, would he not provide endless time to save all of his creation? So, why make it hard? If society was like your god, we wouldn't have ambulances and hospitals. We would let the weak ones die, starve; to hell w 'em. Hospitals rarely throw somebody out into the alley because they refuse to get well, yet that is what your god does.

SS

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