Divine Plan of the Ages - Sundisk? - CT Russell Roessel???

by Celtic 22 Replies latest watchtower scandals

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  Celtic

  I'm reading presently Charles Taze Russell's The Divine Plan of the Ages 1889 edition.

  A question. Today, would CT Russell be allowed to be an acceptable member of the organisation he started?

  What was CT Russell's background before he started the Watchtower Society? Is there any truth at all that he was involved with the occult and to what extent? Was he involved in freemasonry, specifically, his family line? What did he know of 33rd degree masonry? Was the Roessel family, originally from Germany involved with or had links to the illuminati bloodlines? Does anyone here know anything to do with enochian magick? Or mentions of The Watchtowers held therein?

  Has any credible research been done on any of this?

  Lastly. CT Russells resting place. Is it definitely true that CT Russell is buried in a cemetary patch that he owned, under a grave entitled 'The Seventh Laodicean Messenger and is this related without doubt to the pyramidical structure besides his own resting place?

  Celtic
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  RR

  Hi Celtic,

  Your questions, my response:

  What was CT Russell's background before he started the Watchtower Society?

  He was a Congregationlist, a member of the YMCA and then spent a good ten years studying the various Advent Christian groups and individuals.

  Is there any truth at all that he was involved with the occult and to what extent? Was he involved in freemasonry, specifically, his family line? What did he know of 33rd degree masonry? Was the Roessel family, originally from Germany involved with or had links to the illuminati bloodlines? Does anyone here know anything to do with enochian magick? Or mentions of The Watchtowers held therein? Has any credible research been done on any of this?

  None whatsoever, many stories, a few books written about the subject, but no one and I mean no one has come up with a shred of evidence that Russell was ever involved with the mason or any secret societies. The burden of proof is on those who make such a claim, and they have come up with none. Russell disavows any connection with Free Masonry, there are no proofs, no rosters, registries, pictures, documents of him ever being one. In fact, even the Maons deny he was ever a member. Russell's family were of Scotish-Irish descent, not German.

  Lastly. CT Russells resting place. Is it definitely true that CT Russell is buried in a cemetary patch that he owned, under a grave entitled 'The Seventh Laodicean Messenger and is this related without doubt to the pyramidical structure besides his own resting place?

  Russell is buring at what was originally a Bible House family plot, the cemetary originally farm land owned by his uncle. There is a huge Pyramid on the site which has the name of the Society and IBSA on them along with some scriptural verses, and an open book engraved on the sides, to which were to be engraved the anmes of those Bible Students who were buried at the cemetary. A few names appear, mostly faded. C.T. Russell is buried a few yards behind it, his tombstone, recently vandalized, had his picture on it and had engraved on the front "Pastor C.T. Russell The Laodicean Messenger", a reference by those who believe he was the seventh messenger to the Church mentioned in Revelation, chapters 2, 3

  RR
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  link

  RR,

  Thanks for a well researched, well balanced and sensible post. This topic has most people going off half cocked.

  link
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  LittleToe

  Russell never was a JW (the name having been created in the 1930's, well after Rutherford seized control of the organization and hence assets, that Russell had established).

  The Bible Students remain closest to the teachings of the man, of which RR is (as I understand it) a member (and possibly the only active member on this site), and hence are in the best position to make such a statement with any authority.

  To answer your original question: today, unless he radically changed his beliefs, Russell would not be admitted to the WTS.

  For one thing, it appears that he claimed his right to Christian Liberty, and hence to study anything which he wished, in the pursuit of his spiritual journey.

  I know you know all this, ya balmpot, but I wanted to help round out the thread for ya. How are ya doing?)
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  justhuman

  I have a different opinion regarding Russell, and I believe that he was influenced from occult. Although I we don't have the clear evidence we do have a LOT OF FACTS prooving that he was influenced by occult and the freemasons.

  Pyramid worship it is an occult religion (masons do have similar teachings like Russell and symbols like The Sun God Ra and the All Seeing Eye. You can see that at the U.S 1 dollar). So the question it is clear: Why would someone use Masonic symbols and teachings if he was not a Mason or support the masonic ideas?

  Why Russell is buried in a Masonic Cementry with the masonic pyramid and the capstone of the All Seeing Eye?

  Russell has admided in a puplic talk that he WAS a Free mason. You can find that statement from Freeminds.org.

  Russell print a book called Angels and Women a story of a fallen Angel(Demon)that he told it to a medium. So if that it is not occult influence my friend then what it is?

  Many teachings of the Watchtower were influenced from pyramidology and occult, plus the subliminal messages that can be found in the WT puplications. Live for Ever Book, Revelation, are great examples of the subliminal messages of the WT.

  So you have another opinion regarding Russell...the choice is yours...
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  Celtic

  Thank you for your replies. I still find it most odd that in early copies of The Watchtower that in the top right hand corner there appeared a mason symbol, related to the York Ceremony or 32nd degree masonry. Why on earth was this printed on the front cover of the magazines if there is not a shred of evidence to support that he was a mason? Also, that pyramid in the cemetary. That same symbol can be found on there, again why? ... If he had no connection? After I posted this yesterday, whilst researching later, I came across a letter from a french brother to an older sister, member of the remnant, in which he raises many of te same points, so I'm obviously not the only one that has noticed and questioned this. This french brother, upon making inquiries to the Society, was met with a stone walled silence. Why a silence, if there is/was not/never has been a connection? even the front cover of the book The Divine Plan of the Ages written by Russell himself has the logo of the winged sundisk on it, this is irrefutable fact, a copy of the book is in my room right now. Again, why would this be on the cover if there was no connection? This leads me to ask questions naturally. Would the almighty God appoint as his servant, his 'voice' on earth at that time, a man to lead up an organisation to represent him, even with these connections to occultist representations of symbolism. I find this paradoxical to say the least. I tried ringing the Society to ask them, using my membership of a British think tank to offer credibility to my unusual line of questioning, once more silence, there has to be more to this than meets the eye, so to speak. Hope you are all well. Mark
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  Celtic

  My apologies, the symbol appears in the top left hand corner, NOT the top right hand corner. Hang on a tic, I need to get a WT publication.

  Jehovah's Witnesses Proclaimers of God's Kingdom, published 1993 page 200, look at the picture in the caption box. The copy of Zion's Watch tower - Herald of Christ's Kingdom, the symbol appears on the front cover, vol X11 No 1 January 1891. The WT publishers have even highlighted the symbol to draw attention to it.

  Now, if you cross reference this symbol on the internet, you find that definitely, yes, it does have freemasonry overtures or connections. There is no doubting this.

  Which leads me back to my question about whether the true God who deplores any spiritistical practices and the occult, would choose this man Russell to be the founder of His true organisation on earth?

  Regards

  Mark
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  peacefulpete

  Of course much depends upon you definition of "occult" and "spiritism". Many of the beliefs of Russel are today viewed as such. At the time they had a certain respectability in Adventist circles. I can speak about the cemetery. The Masonic lodge across the road from the graveyard was built decades after he was buried. Certain websites have lied about this, claiming it is on the lodge grounds and it was so at the time of his death. Why they feel the need to do so is beyond me. Also I have spoken to Masons at length, they do not associate their symbols or rites with the occult any more than Catholics do their Cross and Eucharist.
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  RR

  Justhuman

  I have a different opinion regarding Russell, and I believe that he was influenced from occult. Although I we don't have the clear evidence we do have a LOT OF FACTS prooving that he was influenced by occult and the freemasons.

  ... and that's is your opinion, you're right!

  Pyramid worship it is an occult religion (masons do have similar teachings like Russell and symbols like The Sun God Ra and the All Seeing Eye. You can see that at the U.S 1 dollar). So the question it is clear: Why would someone use Masonic symbols and teachings if he was not a Mason or support the masonic ideas?

  Tell me what teachings do both have in common, Many religions have similiar beliefs, it doesn''t mean their the same.

  Why Russell is buried in a Masonic Cementry with the masonic pyramid and the capstone of the All Seeing Eye?

  It's NOT a masnic cemetary, and if you went there or did some research, you'd know that! There is a huge Masonic building in the distance, but it's new, it wasn't there in 1916 when Russell and others were buried there. The cemetary was OWNED by Russell, and since sold by the Society. I have a copy of the charter.

  Russell has admided in a puplic talk that he WAS a Free mason. You can find that statement from Freeminds.org.

  You need to look at that talk again in its entirety and not just cut and paste quotes.

  Russell print a book called Angels and Women a story of a fallen Angel(Demon)that he told it to a medium. So if that it is not occult influence my friend then what it is?

  Sorry, Russell NEVER printed Angels and Women, never read it, never recommended. The book was published in 1924, how could he have read it when he died in 1916?

  Many teachings of the Watchtower were influenced from pyramidology and occult, plus the subliminal messages that can be found in the WT puplications. Live for Ever Book, Revelation, are great examples of the subliminal messages of the WT.

  And what teachings would that be, can you give a few examples?

  RR
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  RR

  Hi Celtic, you asked:

  I still find it most odd that in early copies of The Watchtower that in the top right hand corner there appeared a mason symbol, related to the York Ceremony or 32nd degree masonry. Why on earth was this printed on the front cover of the magazines if there is not a shred of evidence to support that he was a mason?

  I'm assuming you are referring to the Cross and Crown symbol. I suggest you do some research, it is NOT a masonic symbol. True the Masons used it, but it was usd by Christians as far as as the 5th century. Many Christian denominations used the symbol today and have used them for centuries. DO a search on teh net under "Cross and Crown" You'd be surprised.

  Also, that pyramid in the cemetary. That same symbol can be found on there, again why? ... If he had no connection?

  Tell me, did the Masons built the pyramid? What makes it a masonic symbol? Many Christian and non-Christians groups believe in the pyramid as being built of God, none have connections to freemassonry. In fact, not even the Masons have an spiritual wrotngs to do with the Pyramids.

  As to the wingsun symbol. Russell stated that it reminded him of the scriptures in proverbs shich describes Jesus as the "sun with healing in his wings."

  RR