The Disfellowshipping/Killing of Jane Part 2

jst2laws

I spoke with another member of Jane's judicial committee late this evening. He has recently disassociated himself and I thought he might like to see the thread. http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/12/64881/1001480/post.ashx#1001480 Instead, he updated me on the story. After I left the state (Georgia) a few years ago Jane (not her real name) struggled to get reinstated. The other member of the committee I spoke with had a small part in that process. She succeeded in getting back in but committed suicide not long afterward. I will not pretend that this information did not hurt. WHY DID THIS HAPPEN? My friend tells me there was talk around that she was depressed, no surprise, and was on a new medication for it. Supposedly this medication made her worse instead of better and she gave up. This is from the JW rumor mill. What really happened? I WISH I KNEW. But more than ever I am angry with this disgusting WT system. This poor lady was desperately looking for something she thought the WT had. She was not compatible with their play world and got abused by it over and over again. Forget the medication problem. Depression killed her. NOW WHAT CAUSED THAT DEPRESSION? I am so damn angry that I had anything to do with this whole *&^$#%^& thing. I wish I could go back and stand up during one of those judicial meetings and give this lady a hug and tell her 'lets walk out of here right now'. 'Lets go read Ray Franz's books together, or Carl Oloff Johnston's, or Jim Penton's book, or lets get on JWD and meet some real people.' Too late for Jane. So, here sets the bag of fertilizer wondering what separates me from the slop covering the stable floor, except the 'bag'. Regrets, good intentions? I don't know. I'm up late and working on Jack Daniels. I should have waited until tomorrow to do this update. But here stands that bag of fertilizer without the bag. If it makes ANYONE feel better to blame me for any Watchtower atrocity they have experienced then here I am. I feel like shit and deserve a kicking, because one more person I had a chance to help instead of hurt has died needlessly. Sometimes I think it is time to move on, and I will eventually, as I hope all of you do when you are ready. But then something like this comes up and I think again how important it is. People are hurting. People are dying. Of all the humanitarian things I might get involved in, would I be able to contribute more than I can with aiding JW's and ExJw's in their journey? At this point, this is what I can do to help others best, if at all. So if Jane's daughter is out there, in north Georgia. contact me here, [email protected] . I have been trying to find you. Jst2laws

Sassy

wow.. I am sorry jst2laws...........wow.. I am without words..

YOU CAN NOT HOLD YOURSELF ACCOUNTABLE FOR SOMETHING AN ORGANIZATION DICTATED YOU TO DO!

pLEASE..

drwtsn32

Wow...I'm so sorry to hear about this! I really hope you're able to locate Jane's daughter. (((Steve)))

DanTheMan

Steve, don't be so hard on yourself bud. (Wait, isn't that what people are always telling me? LOL)

This woman's downward slide was likely inevitable. I have experienced extremely intense, suicidal depressions ever since I was about 14 years old. I don't blame anybody for the occurence of these dark periods when oblivion becomes a welcome notion. If this woman could speak (and who knows maybe she is still alive in some form) I am certain that she would tell you not to blame yourself in any way.

Lady Lee

Steve you were but one cog in a very large wheel. Please do not take all the blame for the actions of an org and others on yourself. Spread the crap around where it belongs.

Yes you were a part of the wheel at the time. But you didn't know then what you know now.

As a counselor who has worked with many people who think of suicide and as a person who has had serious thoughts about suicide in the past there is no one thing or one person that pushes someone to that fatal act. It is a lifetime of things or people. You weren't even the last of the people.

I know if a client of mine had ever tried (fortunately none did) that I would have felt that I somehow failed her. And that might be valid. But ultimately I was only one wee small cog in the giant wheel of life. Even in my worst moments I knew who had a good heart. I knew who really cared and were trying to help. On my JC one of the elders I suspect was outvoted by the other two - or pressured - to DF me.

Rabbit

Jst2laws:

You said:

I will not pretend that this information did not hurt. WHY DID THIS HAPPEN? My friend tells me there was talk around that she was depressed, no surprise, and was on a new medication for it. Supposedly this medication made her worse instead of better and she gave up. This is from the JW rumor mill. What really happened? I WISH I KNEW. But more than ever I am angry with this disgusting WT system. This poor lady was desperately looking for something she thought the WT had. She was not compatible with their play world and got abused by it over and over again. Forget the medication problem. Depression killed her. NOW WHAT CAUSED THAT DEPRESSION? --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- You are carrying a VERY HEAVY LOAD...no doubt. Damn...I am very new to this site and all this, read my posts -- I'm awaiting possible DA/DF myself. I read the 'Jane, Part 1.' I cried when I got to the part about her re-instatement...then her suicide. I have a child who's gone thru a DF, re-instating, falling away again and now I think is being convinced to re-up -- again by my loyal JW x-spouse. My child (grown) tried to commit suicide already 2 years ago. I was already thinking along those lines of 'what might happen' My child suffers from depression, as do I and at least one other child. When I read that last one on Jane..I lost it... Here is something you absolutely NEED to KNOW...EVENTS in a person's life can cause one type of Depression, grief, helpless feelings, one's 'lot' in life, and yes -- being shunned or picked on or shamed publically! Someone can feel Depressed over something they've done or participated in...or for NOT doing something they should have. BUT, there are people like me and maybe some kin, who literally have a CHEMICAL IMBALANCE in their brains that cause Major Depression, a true medical condition. Then, there's Bipolar Depression, which without meds a person can be completely out-of-control...! Then there are a lot of other conditions that would be classed as 'Mental' problems. Now, imagine someone with two, three or more of conditions at the same time. ?? My point is you seem to be blaming yourself, in someways, for your role. That's very rough on yourself. You were doing your part as an Elder, believing you were doing the right thing, for the right reasons...to help Jane. I believe you made an honest mistake. Humans DO that. Think what court Judges must feel when they see later -- that they have mis-judged, made an error! I hope you will be very cautious -- these feelings that Jack Daniels helps with sometimes, can turn into grief and Depression. I admire how warm people are here. I especially admire how people here can 'look back' and be critcal of themselves, laugh at themselves. Most importantly -- that you're here NOW trying to help people like me and other 'Jane's', too. When I see these things...it gives ME hope! Maybe me (& lots of others) understanding how JC meetings and DA & DF's happen, what they do to people 's lives. Don't beat yourself up so bad -- so that another victim and tradgedy doesn't emerge from Jane's. What you DON"T know is what medical condtions Jane had...lot's of others commit suicide who are in no way asso. with JW's. With me, it was a combination: I did not know I had Major Depression, I was going thru marital problems, some related to JW interference, I had started to be inactive. I was getting all the 'good' advice that, " Going to meetings will MAKE you happy." If I had been diagnosed and treated for my Major Depression, I don't THINK I would have let JW related depression make me want to kill myself. I know from experience that some meds can make you worse, they must keep trying until they find the right Rx. I had a bad experience when I was changing from one Rx to a new one. However...that is the dangerous thing. Elders, even well meaning ones, DON"T KNOW what to think of or how they should TREAT a brother or sister, who MAY or MAY NOT have one, two or more of these conditions! So-o, you disfellowship or disassociate the unlucky person, it may be FAR MORE than they can handle. They have no medical/physchological training or qualifications to be making such judgements! Jst2laws - Thank you for helping me! Forgive yourself, too. Yours, Lee

Englishman

Steve,

Don't go rowing out in the Gulf in that kayak! We all do what we think is best at the time with the information that we have available.

Oh yeah..ignore the bayings of the "Millwall supporters" too!

Englishman.

Sirona

For what its worth, I don't blame the guys on my JC. I blame the guys who wrote the "elders" book and told them that if they didn't follow it they'd die. (not following "Jehovah's direction"....you might not survive armageddon....responsibility to keep congregation "clean" blah blah blah).

I can't speak for Jane, but I believe in life after death and I'm sure she knows the whole situation now and can see how you were mislead by the Watchtower organisation, just like she was. She is in a place of healing now where they cannot get to her.

Sirona

calamityjane

sorry Steve

I didn't think I could detest this religion anymore and then hearing this. I'm at a loss for words right now.

love

cj

Shutterbug

Damn, Man. I feel for you. Reconsider the last part of the above quote, "Keep on releasing, and YOU will be released." You surely have been "releasing" (letting offense go) for years now. Its your turn to be "released". Let it go.

Steve,

The above is advice you gave to me in your first post on this subject. Do you suppose that advice might work with you also ??

Having said that, I well know just how difficult it is to put this stuff behind you. Actually I have, but I find it useful to go back to the incident I was involved in so as to remind myself just how low life the org we were involved with really is. Another reminder for me is the print out I have of Tatiana's story. JWD is full of such stories but somehow hers really got to me.

We were a part of a controlling cult. A lot of very intelligent people have fallen into their clutches, but some of us have managed to escape and I feel it is our responsibility to do all that is possible to help others who are are still in the Org as much as possible. With your intelligence, writing skills and experience you seem to be very well suited for this chore. Bug

The Disfellowshipping/Killing of Jane Part 2

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