Believers ? I need your input ? elder called and left my mother in tears

by acsot 36 Replies latest jw friends

  • acsot
    acsot

    [Quick update: almost a year ago my mother had two strokes and a heart attack. Needless to say, we haven?t stepped foot in a Kingdom Hell since then. Some of the rank and file have been kind and supportive, so I have them over to the house once in awhile (I?m also doing it for selfish reasons since it gives me a break and I can get out)]

    Well, the P.O. phoned last night to see if ?we could come and visit you and your mum?. Hmm, could it have anything to do with the double bill of C.O. and D.O. visiting in two weeks time, make it look like they?ve been doing shepherding calls? (as a side note, this elder was on the judicial committee that DF'd SaintSatan)

    I tell him that (a) mum isn?t feeling too well (the truth, she had stomach pains in the evening) and (b) as I mentioned to him previously, last minute calls really don?t work very well under the present circumstances. He said, oh okay maybe next week. I said (my mistake) maybe you can say hello to mum at any rate. Sure.

    They talk for a couple of minutes, mum hangs up then bursts into tears.

    ?I want to go back to the meetings.? she mumbles between sobs. Now I know that part of it was just the thought of getting out of the house, so I say, ?you get out, we went out last night (to my brother?s) for supper, we went to a movie, etc.?

    ?But what?s Jehovah going to think of me, I can?t get to the meetings?. God almighty what did that f&&king elder say to her I?m thinking to myself.

    So then I find myself in the rather weird position of assuaging her guilt induced by this f&&king cult and telling her that Jehovah knows everything she?s done, Jesus came for everyone and that she has been a good person all her life, even before becoming a JW. And that Jesus said by their fruits you will recognize them so actually the elders have more to fear since they haven?t been fulfilling their shepherding duties. I try and help her see that she?ll get her reward because Jesus said ?believe in me and you shall be saved?. Considering that I am now agnostic and think that this is all a fairy tale, this felt really, really strange. I am also totally pissed at that idiot elder.

    Then I go into how attending three meetings a week is not what makes a true Christian. After all, the Society has been wrong before, right? I mentioned 1975 and the generation doctrine. She nodded. So I said that the only thing that mattered was her relationship with Jehovah and Jesus and that since the Society has been wrong in the past they can?t really tell others what being faithful is and what it isn?t. I?m also wondering whether I should give that b&stard elder a call and ask him what on earth he said.

    She calms down eventually and some TV program came on, can?t remember which one, a comedy anyway. I turn it on and she starts watching.

    Then I storm upstairs and call Elder Idiot.

    ?What did you say to my mother? She?s been crying ever since she hung up the phone.?

    ?Oh no, really? I can?t imagine what I said.?

    (To be honest, I don?t think he really did say anything deliberately guilt-inducing, but I have a feeling that just from past conditioning, getting a call from an elder isn?t usually good, which brought on the guilt on my mother?s part. However, my purpose in calling him was twofold)

    Me: ?Well, now she?s crying about what Jehovah thinks of her and she can?t do very much anymore.

    Elder: ?Oh dear, well of course Jehovah loves her, I only have compassion for someone in her circumstances.?

    Me: ?I hope so, I mean, maybe it?s part of the stroke, maybe she doesn?t understand every word properly and took it the wrong way.? (I said this because it?s true, that does happen at times)

    Me (again): ?Anyway, if you do visit it?s going to have to be very light and happy, and you?ll need to be very careful what you say and how you say it.?

    Elder: ?Yes, of course, but we won?t be going over tonight?

    Me: ?Yes, I know that?

    Elder: ?And I don?t call very often either?

    Me: ?Yes, I know that?

    Elder: ?That?s not very good.?

    Me: ?Yes, I know.?

    Elder: ?Well, I?m very very sorry, please forgive me. I don?t honestly know what I said?

    Me: ?Well, I?ll see if I can figure out what happened. And I?ll see about future visits?

    I hang up.

    Now this may not seem like a big deal, but for me this was a giant step. I would have never ever called up an elder and questioned his activities. I would have been afraid I wasn?t being respectful, that I was not being theocratic, etc. So this was a huge step for me. And amazingly, I didn?t brood over it, or worry it to death (my usual modus operandi). I almost forgot about the conversation during the evening and got busy doing other stuff. And making sure my mother was more or less cheerful.

    So, my question to believers: I have no intention of using the NWT, but I thought I?d read some Bible verses to her, probably along the lines of Matthew 11:28-30, etc. Maybe Psalms, but stuff that will take away her WTS induced guilt and help her think that she?s okay in God?s eyes. Since my background is as a JW, I?m not quite sure what I should use. What has helped you? Jesus? blood washing away our sins is fine, but she still thinks she should be getting out there to the Kingdumb hall.

    Any ideas will be welcome.

  • pc
    pc

    Ascot, I sent you a message, pc

  • blondie
    blondie

    acsot, do they have a telephone hookup? It might assuage her guilt, you won't have the hassle of trying to get her there when you don't want to go, you don't have to listen, she may nod off.

    If she is guilty about going out to your brother's, could family gatherings be where your mom is?

    For 70 years, the Israelites were not able to attend religious functions at the temple. Most of them were little children or not born yet by the end of that period. Did God not value their love and worship for him apart from the temple?

    Love you both, Blondie

  • cruzanheart
    cruzanheart

    GOOD FOR YOU!!!! It's empowering to stand up to a bully, isn't it? My favorite chapter of the Bible is 2 Corinthians 4, particularly vss. 16-18. Psalms are always good to read.

    Hugs to you and your mum,

    Nina

  • UpAndAtom
    UpAndAtom

    WOW!! I'm sitting here reading this and thinking to myself, you're doing an excellent job, and have already done everything I would've suggested. You don't need any of my advice.

    I love the way you wrote that too.... took me right there you did. You get mad, but you don't lose your temper. (reminds me when Jesus made a whip and banished the money traders from the synogouge... a "rightous anger" is good stuff indeed and I pity the person that can't muster one, once in a while). Well done!

  • Special K
    Special K

    Hi Ascot...

    I read what happenned...

    You did all the right things.. Everything you said and did was right on.

    I am not up on bible stuff anymore but I'm sure some of the forum members will post some appropriate scriptures to read to your mom so she can feel better. There is alot of comforting reading in the Bible rather than things to tear you down.

    For many, not being at the meetings (even though they can't) can be triggered by just an elders phone call and visit. The elder sounded sincere (from what you posted)..

    Keep up the good work.. and I'm glad you can get your mom out a bit.

    A stroke can leave a person very confused sometimes. Or even makes it hard to handle certain feelings or emotions. Crying does release a lot of pain and some of her crying may have been cleansing for her.

    But.. I know you don't want this go on and on.. That certainly isn't good for her either..Crying for hours can lead into a deeper place..

    Guilt is not something that your mom needs to carry around at this time..

    all the best.. and I'll check back to read some of the suggested reading.

    sincerely

    Special K

  • wannaexit
    wannaexit

    ascot,

    I think you are really to be commended for how you are caring for your mom. Reading the Bible to her will probably really help her to quench some of the guilt she may be feeling.

    Why don't you just start from the gospel accounts. Older people really like listening about Jesus. It will make her feel that she is doing her part.

    I feel for the older ones and the guilt that has been put on them from this blasted cult.

    Instead of enjoying their golden years the older ones are so worried if they can't go to all the meetings and if they can't play the "knock knock game". This is sickening.

  • stillajwexelder
    stillajwexelder

    The ONLY way to beat a bully is to STAND UP TO THEM -- The only way to beat verbal/phsycological bullies (The WTBTS and representatives) is to stand up to them -- be firm, but stand up to them and say what you think - ideally in front of a CO and DO if possible - just my 2 cents -- but it works -trust me

  • Nosferatu
    Nosferatu
    Now this may not seem like a big deal, but for me this was a giant step. I would have never ever called up an elder and questioned his activities. I would have been afraid I wasn’t being respectful, that I was not being theocratic, etc. So this was a huge step for me.

    This is a truly excellent step you have taken for yourself. I also once had a fear of the elders and/or spiritually strong brothers. You're fighting a fear you once had. You're taking it on face to face, and you're beating the shit out of it. Good job!

  • acsot
    acsot

    I knew I could count on you guys! Blondie, my mother loves getting together with my brother, he?s been living out of province for many year and is now on sabbatical and is spending it here, so she's finally getting a chance to get to know her son. There is a telephone hook-up and she does listen via phone, imagine! And there's still guilt! Unf&&kingbelievable!

    For 70 years, the Israelites were not able to attend religious functions at the temple. Most of them were little children or not born yet by the end of that period. Did God not value their love and worship for him apart from the temple?

    B londie : Wow, never thought of that! Thank you. I'm cutting and pasting it for reference.

    Cruzan: Thanks for the suggestion, I?ll use those verses.

    PC: got your message! Thank you.

    UpandAtom: very kind of you - thanks!

    Stillajwxelder: You're absolutely right, and I'm planning on using this past telephone conversation as "ammo" if they dare call again, especially with the D.O.

    wanna: the gospels are good, I'll just read them in a different translation, but I may skip over the denunciations against the Pharisees, unless I can sneak in an application about the WTS!

    Special K: I'm glad you posted that; it reminded me how stroke does cause emotional lability, which can trigger tears and laughter at unexpected and at times inappropriate moments. Maybe that's part of what happened.

    you guys are great

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