But I do still believe that the organization was truly loving and caring and put the congregation first.
If you really believe that, I think you would be well served by going to www.silentlambs.org and reading some of the personal stories on that site. You'll see very quickly how "loving and caring" the organization has been in real life situations.
It's just frustrating that people are so down on the organization.
Why do you find it frustrating that the JW organization is subject to the same sort of criticism it levels at other religions? Are you as frustrated when you read yet another article in the WT or Awake about the evils of the Catholic Church? Any organization making the claims for itself that the WTS does deserves close scrutiny. The WTS is more than willing to scrutinize and criticize other religions, yet is not itself willing (or able) to uphold the same standard it applies to others.
We all have our rights to do what we feel best for ourselves. Right?
Right, without question. No one is questioning your right to do as you wish. We may, however question the soundness of such decisions and your consistency in applying standards to your religion as opposed to others.
"If Jehovah's Witnesses really have the truth, it should be able to stand up to scrutiny." (I don't know how to do the copy where you can tell that I'm doing a quote. Scoozi.)
Haven't they? I mean no other religion gets more scrutiny. And yet they still stand. Steadily increasing.
How do you know they get more scrutiny than others? Because THEY said so? Research hon. You will find all religions get scrutiny. In this world Jehovah's Witnesses are but a drop in a very BIG bucket. More scrutiny than the Catholic church? I don't think so. I talk with people all the time that have never even heard of JWs. How many people do you run into that have NEVER heard of Catholicism? It's never happened to me.
Yes they still stand. But steadily increasing? Says who? THEM? They keep lowering the time necessary to be a regular publisher every so many years. Basically that means they are widening the net of the "counted publishers". Increasing? I doubt it. They're cheating. It's almost as bad as having a room with 10 women...and counting all the mothers in the room...5...and then counting all the sisters in the room...8...and then counting all the daughters in the room...10...and then saying you have 23 in attendance. Not. You still have 10 physical bodies in the room, but you choose how you count them in a way that reflects you in a better light.
BTW - I don't mean to be gripey at you. I do hope you stick around this board and learn. Please check out the quotes page. You'll be amazed at some of the things they themselves have written that contradict their own teachings. Blew me away.
Did you ever read the Watchtower publication entitled "Revelation: It's Grand Climax At Hand!" Do you think that classifying all religions but Jehovah's Witnesses as Babylon the Great is uncritical? Why, then, do Jehovah's Witnesses get upset when others criticize them? "People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones."
Though he is not their legal Mediator , for they are not in the new covenant, he is their means of approaching Jehovah.?
Okay, this sentence contradicts itself. It says Jesus is not our legal mediator, but yet he is our means of approaching Jehovah. Isn't the purpose of a mediator to allow us access to something or somebody else? If that's the case, then why isn't he our legal mediator? Who is our legal mediator?
And whoever said it is right. The reason we find fault with the organization is because of their pompous attitude that they are always right and their claim that they have a monopoly on the truth. If you're going to boast about such understanding, then people have every right to criticize.
Though he is not their legal Mediator , for they are not in the new covenant, he is their means of approaching Jehovah.?
Okay, this sentence contradicts itself. It says Jesus is not our legal mediator, but yet he is our means of approaching Jehovah. Isn't the purpose of a mediator to allow us access to something or somebody else? If that's the case, then why isn't he our legal mediator? Who is our legal mediator?
A question that has been puzzling me, too. Legal mediator versus what--medical mediator??
I appreciate seeing the 1969 Awake excerpt! "CLEARLY Jesus is mankind's mediator". Why isn't that so "clear" anymore, less than 20 years later???
This is something I will DEFINITELY show to my JW neighbor. (We've stopped our talks together for a while as she works toward separating with her husband.) Thanks for bringing it to our attention.
"If Jehovah's Witnesses really have the truth, it should be able to stand up to scrutiny." (I don't know how to do the copy where you can tell that I'm doing a quote. Scoozi.)
Haven't they? I mean no other religion gets more scrutiny. And yet they still stand. Steadily increasing.
Your reasoning goes well for the Islam:
The islam has been through the centuries (and even more now) under severe scrutiny and they are still standing and rapidly increasing their members. So they must have the truth? C'mon!
Scrutiny doesn't kill a religion because it is mostly irrational (ie based on faith rather than evidence).
There are people that believe in alien abduction, the lochness monster and even fairies!
Do some research and you'll see that their logic is flawed and their reasoning full of holes. Sure you can still believe but supported by fact and evidence it is not.
Interesting point, Greven, about Islam. But the greatest factor for their growing numbers is their raising large families. Conversion rates are not as high as other groups.
(Of course, there is no baptism/personal choice issue in Islam, either. If you were born Muslim, you are Muslim. And if you convert away, you are an apostate which (if you live under Shari'a law) means you can--and should--be killed.)
This only dilutes your point somewhat. "Surviving over centuries" doesn't absolutely prove anything in itself, I agree. It does count for a little bit, though, I think.
I understand now. Jehovah is the "main frame/server" and Jesus is the "router". Got it
"The Bible clearly says that Jesus Christ is mankind's redeemer, so he is mankind's mediator.
Well obviously they've since cleared that up with the 1989 "new light" So that would mean that the 144,000 are mankind, and us lowly great crowd are just ....... pond scum.
