If Jesus died so Christians can be saved......

by DevonMcBride 38 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  logansrun

  Little Toe,

  That's insulting, dude.

  Well, it's simply my opinion. That's not to say I don't have a respect for Christianity. I do. But it's a respect more akin to acknowledging Shakespere. I personally can't stand Shakespere, but I understand that he is a great playwright and has had a profound impact on our culture. There are things in the Judeo-Christian philosophy that I admire.

  It's also a position of ignorance, as you've self-confessedly had very little to do with religion since your exit rom the borg.

  No it's not. I'm well aware of what Christianity in it's myriad forms is all about. When I was leaving the organization I studied many different "takes" on the Bible, some very critical, some conservative, some totally nutty. I've read a little bit of a lot of Christian thinking. You seem to conclude that just because I have studied about Christianity, don't believe it, even condemn portions of it, I must be "ignorant."

  B.
• 

  sandy

  EDIT: Not saying that as an insult, I just think that calling a whole religion 'idiocy' is really being unfair. Then again, I guess I wouldn't object if someone said it about JWs so I should just quiet down...

  Yeah, "just quiet down" and let us little devils bash religion and christianity.... lol
• 

  JamesThomas

  Perhaps much of the confusion and angst arises in these type threads because many sense a lie. A bastardization of our existence. The Biblical god conducts himself very much like a ruthless, criminally insane king or ruler. Someone who has no qualms killing large numbers of his own people. Some one like
• 

  LittleToe

  Bradley:
  It's just my 2p, but I suspect you are big on head-learning , but short on experience. That's my overall impression of your posts (on a variety of subjects).

  My advice to you would be to get out and do stuff, rather than keeping the distance that the Internet affords, between yourself and reality.

  You seem to conclude that just because I have studied about Christianity, don't believe it, even condemn portions of it, I must be "ignorant."

  The ignorance that I allude to is purely steeped in the fact that you got as far as "studying" it from afar.
  Whether or not you believe or condemn is of little importance to me, as that's your choice.

  One of these days we'll have to meet up, either side of the Atlantic, and do stuff, little bro (and I don't mean to each other ).

  Maxim for the day: Fear only fear itself!
• 

  LittleToe

  JT:
  An extreme post, my friend, full of evocative language. Some people need to take baby steps.

  ...the Biblical interpretation and concept of god becomes extremely demeaning, cruel and offensive.

  I sense a subtle generalisation, there Not every book of the tome known as the "bible" conveys the same experiential viewpoint of "God".
• 

  JamesThomas

  JT:An extreme post, my friend, full of evocative language. Some people need to take baby steps.

  Dear Ross, and some people need a knock upside the head. What I said was true. There is the Ocean, and there are puddles. If there are "Bibles" that reflect a truly unconditional and available loving Father/God/Source....then, I am not referring to them. Many people hurt deeply at the mere mention of the Biblical interpretation of God; and rightly so, for he is the one who is widely interpreted to kill or punish you in some way if you do not accept him completely....or why even have a book that you must somehow follow? I know the deep pain and suffering inflicted from beliefs in this extremely conditional god. Wounds more agonizing than those inflicted from a physical attack. I lived it, and I still see it and feel it from others around me. I am attempting, perhaps feebly, to help them understand why they may feel the way they do, and that perhaps there is a more open and loving way that is closer than ever imagined. I agree that we often need to take "baby-steps. But who are we to judge who or when? Perhaps these "baby-step" people you keep protecting and seemingly want to keep in the dark need to hear something else. They may be more ready and willing than you give them credit for......and if they are so fragile as you imply, they will not hear me anyway. Only those who have ears, hear. They will hear when it is there time...if ever. I don't feel you need worry. You seem to think that everything has a time and place, except my comments. In this, you are mistaken. If I am wrong about this, then I apologize. j
• 

  DevonMcBride

  No this was not a drive by shooting or an anti-Christian attack. It's a biblical fact.

  Christians believe Jesus died for their sins. Those responsible for his death carried out God's plan.

  Devon
• 

  Abaddon

  I didn't think JT's post was extreme.

  His stance is as substansiatable as your own Ross (I'd say 'more so' but we can easily agree on 'as').

  Thus if your view of his stance is that it is extreme,by definition, so must your stance be when viewed from an equally strong yet polar view.

  Is it as cold in Scotland as it is here in the Nether-Netherlands?

  All the best

  Gyles
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  Phantom Stranger

  OK, Devon, why was Christ's murder part of God's plan, but Adam's fall was not?

  (P.S. -I know the JW answer to this - I'd like to hear Devon's, since he was not a JW, if I recall correctly...)
• 

  LittleToe

  James:

  You seem to think that everything has a time and place, except my comments. In this, you are mistaken. If I am wrong about this, then I apologize.

  Apology accepted. I believe that everything has a time and place, period, including your comments My concerns were only that you paint a "God" who is extreme. If you were merely talking about the "God" of the OT, then you may have a point, but other books of the "bible" paint another picture. Gyles:

  I didn't think JT's post was extreme.

  Not his post, just his tone.

  His stance is as substansiatable as your own Ross (I'd say 'more so' but we can easily agree on 'as').

  Agreed. However, you still don't get my "stance, do you? Maybe I threw you off, the other week, with my comments on Calvinism - LOL.

  Thus if your view of his stance is that it is extreme,by definition, so must your stance be when viewed from an equally strong yet polar view.

  My stance is nearer to his than you'd ever believe.

  Is it as cold in Scotland as it is here in the Nether-Netherlands?

  It's ruddy freezing, mate.
  The snow is settling a little, which sux, coz I've got a roadtrip planned for all over Mainland Scotland OTOH, it's beautiful, even down to the sensation of chill seeping into the bones...