OK, I actually Saw the Passion

by Yerusalyim 54 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • Phantom Stranger
    Phantom Stranger

    Schlock, Yes; Awe, No; Fascism, Probably
    The flogging Mel Gibson demands.
    By Christopher Hitchens

    The gay movement in the United States?and the demand for civil unions and even for actual marriage?has had at least one good effect with which nobody can quarrel. The closeted homosexual is a sad figure from the past, and so is the homosexual who tries desperately to "marry" a heterosexual, thus increasing misery and psychic repression all round.

    This may seem like an oblique way in which to approach Mel Gibson's ghastly movie The Passion. But it came back to me this week that an associate of his had once told me, in lacerating detail, that an evening with Mel was one long fiesta of boring but graphic jokes about anal sex. I've since had that confirmed by other sources. And, long before he emerged as the spear-carrier for the sort of Catholicism once preached by Gen. Franco and the persecutors of Dreyfus, Mel Gibson attained a brief notoriety for his loud and crude attacks on gays. Now he's become the proud producer of a movie that relies for its effect almost entirely on sadomasochistic male narcissism. The culture of blackshirt and brownshirt pseudomasculinity, as has often been pointed out, depended on some keen shared interests. Among them were massively repressed homoerotic fantasies, a camp interest in military uniforms, an obsession with flogging and a hatred of silky and effeminate Jews. Well, I mean to say, have you seen Mel's movie?

    I think that it's a healthy sign for our society that so many Jews have decided to be calm and unoffended by the film, and that so many Christians say they don't feel any worse about Jews after having seen it. We have a social consensus where Jews feel more secure and Christians less insecure. Good. But this does not alter the fact that The Passion is anti-Semitic in intention and its director anti-Semitic by nature. Some people including myself think that Abe Foxman and the Anti-Defamation League are too easily prone to charge the sin of anti-Semitism. But if someone denies the Holocaust one day and makes a film accusing Jews of Christ-killing the next day, I have to say that if he's not anti-Jewish then he's certainly getting there.

    It's important to scan the Reader's Digest interview with Mel Gibson. He was questioned by Peggy Noonan, who was almost as simperingly lenient in print as Diane Sawyer was on the small screen. Noonan asked him a question that he must have known was coming, and which he must have prepared for, and she asked him in effect to "make nice" and agree that the Holocaust actually had occurred. His answer was, to all effects and purposes, a cold and flat "no." A lot of people, he agreed, had died in the last war. No doubt many Jews were among the casualties. It's one of the most frigid and shrugging things I have ever read. You would not know from this response that the war was begun by a fascist ruling party that believed in a Jewish world conspiracy, and thus that all of those killed were in part victims of anti-Semitism. (Some of the more tribal ADL advocates might also bear this in mind.)

    But then, you were not brought up by Mel Gibson's father, who has repeatedly and recently stated that there was a population explosion among European Jews in the years 1933-1945 and that the Holocaust story is mainly "fiction." Young Gibson, when asked about this by Diane Sawyer, told her not to press him (which she obediently did not). But when asked by Noonan, he replied by saying that "My father has never told me a lie." It's not fair to expect Mel to trash his father. But he could have said that the old man was a fine daddy, albeit with a few odd ideas of his own. It was his very decided choice, however, to say that his male parent was an unvarying truth-teller. Why pick on that formulation? It's unlikely that Gibson Sr. has made a secret of his viciously anti-Jewish views when talking to his son, who shares with him a fanatical attachment to the Latin Mass and a deep hostility to the "liberalism" of the present pope.

    So let us not be euphemistic about what is staring us in the face. Last Wednesday, the Lovingway United Pentecostal Church in Denver posted a sign on its roadside marquee. It read "Jews Killed the Lord Jesus." This pigsty of a church has, I think you will agree, an unimprovable name. But its elders, or whatever they call themselves, can't have had time to see the movie, which only opened that same Ash Wednesday. Nor, I think it safe to say, had they chosen the slogan only on the spur of the moment. No: They had been thinking this for quite a long time and were emboldened to "come out" and say so under the cover of a piece of devotional cinematic pornography. Some of us saw this coming. In America, I hope and believe, the sinister effect will be blunted by generations of civilized co-existence. But think for a moment what will happen when Gibson reaps the residual and overseas profits from screenings of the film in Egypt and Syria, or in Eastern Europe, where things are a bit more raw. Who can believe that he did not anticipate, and intend, this result?

    Apparently seeking to curry favor, Gibson announced a few weeks ago that he had cut the scene where a Jewish mob yells for the blood of Jesus to descend on the heads of its children (a scene that occurs in only one of the four contradictory Gospels). Gibson lied. The scene is still there, spoken in Aramaic. Only the English subtitle has been removed. Propagandists in other countries will be able to subtitle it any way they like. This is all of a piece with the general moral squalor of his project. Gibson's producer lied when he said that a pope Gibson despises had endorsed the film. He would not show the movie to anyone who might object in advance. He will not debate any of his critics, and he relies on star-stricken pulp interviewers to feed him soft questions. Now, as the dollars begin to flow from this front-loaded fruit-machine of cynical publicity, he is sobbing about the risks and sacrifices he has made for the Lord. A coward, a bully, a bigmouth, and a queer-basher. Yes, we have been here before. The word is fascism, in case you are wondering, and we don't have to sit through that movie again.

    Christopher Hitchens is a columnist for Vanity Fair and a regular contributor to Slate. His most recent book is A Long Short War: The Postponed Liberation of Iraq.

    Article URL: http://slate.msn.com/id/2096323/

  • Pistoff
    Pistoff

    I have tried to avoid venting about this movie, and thus justify my namesake, but I give up.

    This movie is ridiculous.

    Mel Gibson IS anti-semitic. He does NOT believe that Jews were targeted in the holocaust; you could tell by his answer to Diane Sawyer when asked about it: he said"yeah, sure". That is not an acknowledgment, it is a throw away comment to get her off his back.

    What inspires me about Jesus is more than his sacrifice. I know how he died; it was brutal and he had a choice, and he made the choice to die. In fact, it was prophesied; it is a GOOD thing that he died, correct? Then why make the people who had a part in his death the villains? [Why the focus on the gore and violence? Is it an attempt to justify the extreme, nutty and stupid traditions of Opus Dei, which requires flogging on a monthly basis?]

    What other agenda does Mel Gibson have here, if not anti-semitic?

    Here is another news flash for the idiots who go on about this: Jesus is NOT DEAD ANY LONGER! He was resurrected, remember? So why blame anyone for his death when he chose to die, and he is no longer dead?

    Anyway.

    What inspires me about Jesus is his LIFE and his teachings. He challenged an entrenched, corrupt and obsolete religious system. He showed an entire generation that to worship God, it was not necessary to have all the structure that existed, and had become bogged down in tradition and obsessed with irrelevant things; you needed only 2 laws, love God with all your being, and love your neighbor as yourself. And spread the word.

    All of a sudden, an entire religious power structure was OBSOLETE. People were free of it's influence, if they so chose. [Sadly, an entire NEW power structure sprang up, congregations and all, in it's place. The large modern day versions of the structure in Jesus' day have committed all the sickening, revolting things that vast power structures commit, only they claim divine right along the way.]

    I wonder, does Mel discuss this idea in the movie? Does he dwell on the great teaching ability of Jesus? Does he show in hollywood detail the flowering of people's faith? Or is he instead focused on provoking only intense emotion at his [chosen, foretold, inevitable] death??

    Personally, I think Mel Gibson is nuts. I saw the interview and he was twitching like a speed freak. I don't think he is, but he has all the traits of an unbalanced religious fanatic.

  • RedhorseWoman
    RedhorseWoman

    A Catholic on the Beliefnet board said that he was of the opinion that Satan with the baby was supposed to be an evil parody of Mary and the baby Jesus. Sounds fairly logical to me.

  • Double Edge
    Double Edge

    I too saw this movie a couple of hours ago. It affected me profoundly, as well as a lot of the audience. For two hours the audience was glued to the screen....

    I too saw the Mel Gibson interview, and I'll have to agree with you... he did come off a little 'twitchy'... however, as a filmmaker, he's made a very powerful film. It's been a few hours since I left the theatre, and I still can't shake the feeling that I have (I can't explain it, and I can't shake it....but it's definately positive).

    A Catholic on the Beliefnet board said that he was of the opinion that Satan with the baby was supposed to be an evil parody of Mary and the baby Jesus. Sounds fairly logical to me
    hmmm.... now that you mention it, that sounds about right. that was an eerie scene...
  • Yerusalyim
    Yerusalyim

    Mel's a good guy. This is a good movie.

    Phantom, what the HECK over?

    Pistoff,

    Stay that way.

  • freedom96
    freedom96

    Just came back from seeing this movie. I don't think words can quite describe it.

    I don't think the Jews are getting overly slammed, I don't think Gibson is anti-semetic. History is history, and I think he did a fairly accurate job of showing us what happened. The fact is that the Romans appeared much more evil in this movie than the Jews.

    The movie is meant to shock; I don't think most people, even Christians really have thought about what Jesus really went through.

    I am glad I saw this movie, and everyone I have talked to were glad they saw it too. Pretty quiet crowd leaving the theatre.

    Though it might have been nice to have more of Jesus talking to the diciples, and doing miracles, that was not the point of the movie. Plus, there really was not time to do so. The movie alone is a little over 2 hours long, and I think most people are emotionally drained by the end, so to have added much more would have lost the impact, and would have been just way too long.

    Glad I saw it, and would have no problem recommending it to others. Definately not for children, and for those who don't believe in Jesus, they are just going to pick it apart anyways, because they don't believe.

  • LittleToe
    LittleToe

    Freedom:

    Definately not ... for those who don't believe in Jesus, they are just going to pick it apart anyways, because they don't believe.

    Interesting, huh?
    For all the claimed "open-mindedness", they just can't help but "have a go".
    Rather than at least just accept it for an adaptation of literature, they seem to feel an overpowering desire to lambast.

    I wonder if they picked apart "Sparticus" in the same manner?

    ~ducking and running~

    Edited to add:
    I'm looking forward to seeing it. It isn't released here, in Britain, until March 26th

  • A Paduan
    A Paduan

    I never really thought about the line, "look at this guy, isn't this flogging enough?" much before - though I do remember back to school where one of the franciscans emphasised the brutality of the flogging to me - still, I never really focused on that bit.

    I think it was timely of Mel to point it out.

  • Abaddon
    Abaddon

    Little Toe;

    I am Sparticus!

    BAD example. Sparticus wasn't based on an International Best Seller. Lord of the Rings was, and people get VERY impassioned about the variation between book and film.

    I don't see why a non-Christian doing the same with this Jesus film when it departs from the source texts is different.

    Where it is different is in the fact there have been no recorded instances of Orc-bashing as a result of LOTR. I wonder if we'll be able to say that about the Passion and Jew-bashing? Remember, some ignorant twats killed a Seikh after 9/11 just 'cause he was wearing a turban.

  • TheSilence
    TheSilence
    Definately not ... for those who don't believe in Jesus, they are just going to pick it apart anyways, because they don't believe.

    Interesting, huh?
    For all the claimed "open-mindedness", they just can't help but "have a go".
    Rather than at least just accept it for an adaptation of literature, they seem to feel an overpowering desire to lambast.

    I don't necessarily believe in Jesus. I don't necessarily *disbelieve* in him, either, but I imagine I would qualify for the group of people discussed above.

    I have not picked apart the movie, had a go, felt or acted upon an overpowering desire to lambast.

    You are making these statements based upon the statements of a few. Most non-religious people who I know who have seen the movie did none of those things, but were interested in the movie itself and whether or not it affected them or changed their opinions in any way.

    For myself, my interest has been trying to discover if my reaction to the movie was simply a normal way to deal with the level of violence that was portrayed or if my reaction was more to do with how I am because of growing up in the cult we all know and love.

    Jackie

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