Have You Ever Heard This Explanation Why 144,000 is a Literal Number? (page 2)

gods vigilante

Recently they've changed their views on incense and have said that it's up to one's conscience. Of course, as long as we don't stumble anyone else.

Well then if ONE LAMB is a literal number. Therefore we must take as literal that it is a LAMB not a human that is with the 144,00. So the 144,000 mediate with a small fluffy white animal. Explains why their wooly-minded teachings.

plmkrzy

I had always concluded that the number was based on 12,000 from each of the 12 tribes of Israel, and was therefore a very symbolic number.

Same here. I never heard that other explination before. Was the speaker a youngin'?

rocketman

One reason given is that the number of 144,000 must be literal (and limited) because it contrasts with the great crowd, "which no man was able to number" - the idea being that if symbolic then no actual number would be given.

midwest

this may be a little off topic regaurding the 144,000 number but if you read there book on revelations it they break down the 144,000

into groups of 24 of 6,000 to egual 144,000 more double talk

lisavegas420

I asked the sister that comes over why was 144,000 taked as a literal number, her answer to me was because it was mentioned in Revelation's twice......

Lisa

Mary

the scripture talks about the Lamb and the 144,000. It doesn't say Lambs as in more than one....No, it says Lamb referring to the "literal number of one Lamb". So thats how we know that the 144,000 is a literal number and not symbolic like all the rest of Revelation

Yep, that explanation has been around for a while, cause that's what I was told too. I had a much better argument: If the 144,000 is a literal number, than the 12,000 out of every tribe of Israel must also be literal as that's where the tally of 144,000 comes from. In other words, this must be a literal number of literal Jews. It cannot be a literal number of symbolic Jews---you can't have it both ways. The elder didn't like it when I said that.

roybatty

The "typical" WT party line is that since the "great crowd" that John sees isn't numered meaning it is a huge amount of people, whereas the "little flock" or "anointed" are referred to with a specific number, that this means the 144,000 has to be a literal number.

As already noted, the question come up "um...but isn't just about everything in that chapter symbolic? so EVERYTHING else is symbolic BUT the 144,000 number?" lol

ozziepost

G'day Had Enough,

This makes me very happy - just like 'old times' to be responding to one of your threads. So very glad you made it - Mrs Ozzie will be 'tickled pink'. There's a much better atmosphere here these days and some immensely interesting topics have been surfacing. Seems like there's something for everyone.

Before I forget, could you confirm your email addy. I must send another email with latest news to you. My address is still the hotmail one.

Now, back 'on topic':

It must have been difficult for you entering 'that place' again. It's not something Mrs Ozzie could entertain ever again. You know how we welcomed beaker last week? Well, he noticed how upset Mrs Ozzie was when last he saw her - it was actually her very last meeting attendance. It was strange being reminded of it and learning that others had noticed.

As for that 'interpretation' you heard at the Memorial talk - well, what can you say but "Huh?"

It doesn't make sense. In their zeal to denigrate opposing views or anyone who would teach contrary to their beliefs, they go 'over the edge'.

The Lamb by his very nature must be singular. God is singular. Jesus is singular, etc. What else would it be but a lamb (singular)? But to justify the literal interpretaion of 144,000 on that basis is.......well, what can you say but shake your head in disbelief. Even apocalyptic literature, which Revelation is, contains some 'literality', not that speaking of Jesus as a lamb is too literal.

If the number 144,000 is literal, then how come there were more christians than that in the first couple of centuries? And if the WTS is correct that there was a great apostasy and so the aforementioned cannot be counted as "true christians", how do they explain Jesus' parting words to his disciples at Matthew 28:20 when he promised "And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age" (NIV) Note the "always", "to the very end of the age". The WTS teaching doesn't hold water. Don't believe a word of it.

Cheers, Ozzie

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AlanB

Incense? Isn't that something that hippies & druggies use??

Hmmm, has it occurred to anyone else that St John may have used insense (to take away the smell of whatever he was smoking) at the time he wrote this....?

8 And when he took the scroll, the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb, having each one a harp and golden bowls that were full of incense, and the [incense] means the prayers of the holy ones. 9 And they sing a new song, saying: ?You are worthy to take the scroll and open its seals, because you were slaughtered and with your blood you bought persons for God out of every tribe and tongue and people and nation, 10 and you made them to be a kingdom and priests to our God, and they are to rule as kings over the earth.?

Have You Ever Heard This Explanation Why 144,000 is a Literal Number?