Freedom to Choose God

by UnDisfellowshipped 774 Replies latest watchtower bible

• 

  ellderwho

  Whatever individual sand grain happens to be the last down the hole we can call the winner.

  Winner of what? Remember theres no purpose.

  Then it is demonstrated that you exist within the natural laws of the universe that cannot change.

  Therefore any change in your thinking is simply chemical reactions in your brain, that are causing you to say this, because you cannot rise above the laws that bind you.

  What do you think the fate of the grain of sand is? I didn't postulate one.

  I think you did, you go down the hole.

  What do you think my purpose is?:

  Are you under the same laws as the grain of sand?

  Of course.

  :: All of the grains obey certain statistical physical laws in falling through the hole, but it can hardly be argued that physical law was designed to enable a sand grain to survive

  You have no choice its been decided by natural law.

  It seems to me you really have no freedom, or independency, and you are guided by these laws. That you can never exceed. Just a bag of chemicals reacting to stimuli.

  I believe your arguement is from silience, because you will never know the outcome.

  Anything more is against what defines evolution.

  E.
• 

  gumby

  could tell someone that I know of a really interesting guy called AlanF, that they should come listen to him sometime, and (were there such a group) that they should join the "F-ites

  Their ain't no way yer gettin me to join the F-ites cuz I already got baptised as a Farkelite and I ain't changing now......you kilt wearin, convertin bastard you!

  Gumby
• 

  LittleToe

  Gumby:
  I should clarify that both groups are "F-ites". One side is liberal and one side is conservative.
  I'll leave it to you to determine which is which...
  
• 

  ellderwho

  LittleToe,

  Where we hi-jacked? And why do you put DDog in hyper-Cal ??

  E.
• 

  LittleToe

  EW:
  It's just my opinion, of course, but surely discussing ""Freedom to Choose God" presupposes that someone actually believes in the existance of God(s)?
  It seems that the last page or so has gone back to discussing this fundamental.

  As for Hyper-Calvinism, one of the triggers for that would be Double-Predestination. I see plenty of that, here in the heartland of Scottish Presbyterianism, where some folks state that it's not their fault that God doesn't want them...
• 

  ellderwho

  where some folks state that it's not their fault that God doesn't want them...

  I dont think DD is presenting that thought.

  I'll re-read DD post to see.....

  E.
• 

  SixofNine

  I will pick up just one comment, at this point, though:

  DDog: I do not make the claim to know the mind of God.
  AlanF: Then you're not much of a Christian, nor do you have any right to tell people about your God.

  Now who's comparing apples and oranges?

  It doesn't look to me like a comparison at all, just commentary on the idea expressed here: "what the hell is all this 15 pages of god this and god that about if you don't even "claim to know the mind of god"?

  I could tell someone that I know of a really interesting guy called AlanF, that they should come listen to him sometime, and (were there such a group) that they should join the "F-ites". Would the fact that I dont know the mind of AlanF mean that I wasn't an "F-ite", or that I have no right to tell people about you?
  (and kindly don't sidestep by declaring that there will never be such a group... the point I'm establishing is surely obvious)

  Your point isn't obvious to me. Are you saying that people should go about just-making-stuff-up about AlanF, but then if anyone calls them on their "making-shit-up" ways, they should just say "well, I never actually claimed to know Alan's mind"? Because that's what people who tell other people about god or gods are doing; making-shit-up. After a while, it's lame, and it's dishonest. Using a book written by unknown authors purporting to give you AlanF's mind on matters doesn't make you any less lame or any more honest.

  In any case, no one has any right to tell people things about AlanF that aren't true (no matter how strongly you believe those things) (even if you have an F tattood between your eyes and special underwear you purchased from the Faurbacher gift shop). Sorry for misspelling your name god, but I don't have time to look it up.

  One nice thing about AlanF as a god, I must admit, is that with a stake, an accelerant, and some matches, he is falsefiable.
• 

  LittleToe

  Six:

  ..."what the hell is all this 15 pages of god this and god that about if you don't even "claim to know the mind of god"?

  A mini version of the Bible (1Cor.2:16) ?

  One nice thing about AlanF as a god, I must admit, is that with a stake, an accelerant, and some matches, he is falsefiable.

  LOL

  Now go back and answer Xena's reply to you
• 

  SixofNine

  Now go back and answer Xena's reply to you

  er... I didn't see it as a question. I see (and saw) her point and mostly agree with it. If she took my comment as some kind of agressive attack, then she is naughty and needs to be spanked.

  edited to add that the basic point I wanted to make is that most faiths don't have harmful doctrine that need to be rooted out.

  I would just say that many faiths may not currently have doctrine that will actually kill you, but any faith based on the bible or the Quran does have at the very least dormant doctrine that is/was harmful and needs to be rooted out, at least on a personal basis, for anyone to have a life approaching mental freedom.
• 

  Xena

  then she is naughty and needs to be spanked.

  isn't that just a given six?

  Religion is just a tool that if used incorrectly or with malice can maim or kill. Alternately it can be used to enhance life. It's all in how you use it and what you do with it.