This generation has by no means passed away.

by AlanB 23 Replies latest jw experiences

• 

  BluesBrother

  The "New truth" in 1995 planted what was perhaps the first seed of doubt in my mind ..It was, in my view, such an obvious piece of shaping doctrine to match the circumstance. After all they quoted W E Vine:-

  *** w95 11/1 p. 12 Saved From a "Wicked Generation" ***

  "That which has been begotten, a family; . . . successive members of a genealogy . . . or of a race of people . . . or of the whole multitude of men living at the same time, Matt. 24:34; Mark 13:30; Luke 1:48; 21:32; Phil. 2:15, and especially of those of the Jewish race living at the same period." (W. E. Vine?s Expository Dictionary of New Testament Words)

  They failed to quote the rest of the paragraph on the same page which I now have, under the word Genea. "Transferred from the people to the time in which they lived, the word came to mean an age, ie a period ordinarily occupied by each successive generation, say of thirty or forty years "

  My Oxford Dictionary says under "generation" " A step in a pedigree, all persons born about the same time, the average time in which childen are ready to take the place of their parents (about 30 years"

  From this is deduced:-

  ***

  w95 11/1 p. 17 A Time to Keep Awake ***

  Eager to see the end of this evil system, Jehovah?s people have at times speculated about the time when the "great tribulation" would break out, even tying this to calculations of what is the lifetime of a generation since 1914. However, we "bring a heart of wisdom in," not by speculating about how many years or days make up a generation, but by thinking about how we "count our days" in bringing joyful praise to Jehovah. (Psalm 90:12) Rather than provide a rule for measuring time, the term "generation" as used by Jesus refers principally to contemporary people of a certain historical period, with their identifying characteristics.

  Contempory people surely live about the same time and "Pass away" at about the same time. Now I am not a scholar, I am saying that I could never understand the point they were making. It rendered Jesus' comment meaningless. verses 32 - 33 of Matt 24 contain an illustration of the urgency of the times and heeding the warning, then "Truly I say to you that this generation will by no means pass away until all these things occur" . Sounds plain enough to me..
• 

  GermanXJW

  There a enough JW that still believe this because of reports like that.
• 

  XQsThaiPoes

  The problem you have is this is Jesus prophecy. There is nothing in the bible about false interpetation. The watchtower promoted Jesus prophecy would be fullfiled in our day starting from 1914. That is not the case.
• 

  TD

  Contempory people surely live about the same time and "Pass away" at about the same time. Now I am not a scholar, I am saying that I could never understand the point they were making.

  I think the real "trick" to the new (Post 1995) interpretation is understanding that they redefined not only the term "generation" but the term "pass away" as well.

  The term "pass away" used to mean dying (passing away) from old age. After 1995, it meant execution at Armageddon. In true Watchtoweresque fashion, this change was slipped in one month ahead of the November article.

  Once they had disconnected "passing away" from the age of the group in question, they were free to redefine generation to mean whoever happened to be alive at the time this event ocurred. 1914 was thus completely cast aside as a temporal anchor point.

  Of couse this renders the whole statement a meaningless tautology:

  This generation (Those living during the sign who take no note of it) will not pass away (Be destroyed at Armageddon) until all these things (The entire sign including Armageddon) occur.

  If that's all Jesus really meant, you have to wonder why he even bothered to say it
• 

  XQsThaiPoes

  Didnt they say in 1997 that "this generation" only meant the people jesus was talking to, and it was fullfilled in 70 ce.
• 

  TD

  Didnt they say in 1997 that "this generation" only meant the people jesus was talking to, and it was fullfilled in 70 ce.

  I have never seen the Witnesses take such a common sense approach to the Bible. That smacks of preterism
• 

  Leolaia

  Yes, it sure smacks of preterism. XQs...got any cites? Note that v. 34 says that "this generation" would not pass away until "ALL THESE THINGS" occur...and that includes the preaching of the gospel of the kingdom to the "WHOLE world" in v. 14, the "coming of the Son of Man" in v. 27, the sun darkening and stars falling from the sky in v. 28, the "sign" of the Son of Man appearing in the sky with the Son walking on the clouds of heaven in v. 29, and the angels gathering up the elect in v. 31. So saying that v. 34 was fulfilled in AD 70 would imply a preterist interpretation unless one would completely ignore the context. But of course the original interpretation completely ignored the context. There is nothing in the chapter that mentions a much later generation at the time of the fulfillment of the oracle. The reference to "THIS" generation, by normal rules of deixis, would relate to discursive proximity....such as one shared by his interlocutors or, if referring to a still-future generation, one that has recently been mentioned in the discourse. Since no other generation was mentioned in the apocalyptic discourse, the reference had to be to the one hearing Jesus' words. In fact, "this generation" or "this wicked generation" is a stereotyped phrase that occurs throughout the gospel (cf. Matthew 11:16, 12:39, 41, 42, 45, 16:4, 23:36), clearly with reference to Jesus' contemporaries. Thus in 17:17, Jesus addresses them as "O unbelieving and perverse generation". The matter is entirely plain in Matthew 16:27-28. The book clearly expects the "end of the age" (24:3) and the "day of judgment" (12:36, 41-42) as occuring in the lifetime of Jesus' contemporaries -- an expectation also reflected in late works such as John 21:22-23 (an appendix later added to the book), James 5:7-8, Hebrews 10:36, 2 Peter 3:3-4, 8-9, 11, and 2 Timothy 3:1, 4:3.
• 

  confusedjw

  I saw that too. The poor guys had to be helped to the podium to lay their wreaths.
• 

  XQsThaiPoes

  *** w99 5/1 pp. 10-12 "These Things Must Take Place" ***

  Contemporaries Would See It

  11 Many Jews felt that their system of worship, centered on the temple, would long continue. But Jesus said: "Learn from the fig tree . . . this point: Just as soon as its young branch grows tender and it puts forth leaves, you know that summer is near. Likewise also you, when you see all these things, know that he is near at the doors. Truly I say to you that this generation will by no means pass away until all these things occur. Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will by no means pass away."?Matthew 24:32-35.

  1 2 In the years leading up to 66 C.E., Christians would have seen many of the preliminary elements of the composite sign being fulfilled?wars, famines, even an extensive preaching of the good news of the Kingdom. (Acts 11:28; Colossians 1:23) When, though, would the end come? What did Jesus mean when he said: ?This generation [Greek, ge·ne·a´] will not pass away?? Jesus had often called the contemporaneous mass of opposing Jews, including religious leaders, ?a wicked, adulterous generation.? (Matthew 11:16; 12:39, 45; 16:4; 17:17; 23:36) So when, on the Mount of Olives, he again spoke of "this generation," he evidently did not mean the entire race of Jews throughout history; nor did he mean his followers, even though they were "a chosen race." (1 Peter 2:9) Neither was Jesus saying that "this generation" is a period of time.

  13 Rather, Jesus had in mind the opposing Jews back then who would experience the fulfillment of the sign he gave. Regarding the reference to "this generation" at Luke 21:32, Professor Joel B. Green notes: "In the Third Gospel, ?this generation? (and related phrases) has regularly signified a category of people who are resistant to the purpose of God. . . . [It refers] to people who stubbornly turn their backs on the divine purpose."

  14 The wicked generation of Jewish opposers who could observe the sign being fulfilled would also experience the end. (Matthew 24:6, 13, 14) And that they did! In 70 C.E., the Roman army returned, led by Titus, son of Emperor Vespasian. The suffering of the Jews who were again bottled up in the city is almost beyond belief. Eyewitness Flavius Josephus reports that by the time the Romans demolished the city, about 1,100,000 Jews had died and some 100,000 were taken captive, most of those soon to perish horribly from starvation or in Roman theaters. Truly, the tribulation of 66-70 C.E. was the greatest that Jerusalem and the Jewish system had ever experienced or would ever experience. How different the outcome was for Christians who had heeded Jesus? prophetic warning and had left Jerusalem after the departure of the Roman armies in 66 C.E.! The anointed Christian "chosen ones" were "saved," or kept safe, in 70 C.E.?Matthew 24:16, 22.

  Sorry it was 99 not 97 when they decided that the chritendoms stance on the generation was correct and it applied to the jews Jesus was talking to. The article touches on 1914 but that is not the generation that "will not pass away". They claim this wicked generation will see the tribulation but there is no "will not pass away" connection just we are in the last days speil.
• 

  AlanB

  Taken in context with Ray's observations in CoC, it appears that the GB have been wrestling with this one for some time. The 1995 'light' is their attempt to wriggle out of this one.

  I was visiting my Parents a few weeks back and dug out two awakes, one old one with the 1914 banner and a newer one. I asked him to spot the difference. Interesting that he could not see it, the typeface and layout are so similar. My son, who is brought up as a JW by my ex is very bright and has started to think for himself spotted it. There was an akward silence from my Dad.

  I really have to be carefull when visiting my parents now, I have to surpress the urge to tell them the things I have learned as he is starting to react in the way he always reacted when he was wrong and shut me up. He actually told me, 'do you think I want to hear this?' So perhaps at least some seed has been planted and he may stop criticizing my lifestyle and telling me I have broken my baptism vows and should come back to the 'truth'.

  A